Full Transcript:

00:00:00.680 –> 00:00:02.640
John Kennedy: Hello, welcome to Tape Notes, and I hope you are well.

00:00:02.640 –> 00:00:04.680
John Kennedy: We have got a new episode for you this week.

00:00:04.680 –> 00:00:14.320
John Kennedy: I was joined by Lizzy McAlpine along with co-producers, co-writers and bandmates, Mason Stoops and Taylor Mackall to talk about how they brought her most recent album, Older, to life.

00:00:14.320 –> 00:00:19.680
John Kennedy: We caught up at Miloco’s The Pool just ahead of Lizzy’s two nights playing in London towards the end of their tour.

00:00:19.680 –> 00:00:21.500
John Kennedy: I was gutted I wasn’t able to go to those shows.

00:00:21.500 –> 00:00:23.620
John Kennedy: Some of the team went and they said it was amazing.

00:00:23.620 –> 00:00:28.140
John Kennedy: They’ve been touring since April in the US, around Australia and Europe, finishing up in Ireland.

00:00:28.500 –> 00:00:34.680
John Kennedy: And you can really hear the magic and chemistry that they’ve got in the conversation that we had as part of this new episode.

00:00:34.680 –> 00:00:47.380
John Kennedy: To watch the full video of the podcast, head to the Tape Notes Patreon page at patreon.com/tapenotes, as well as access to the full video episodes, which often includes screen capture of the artist sessions and often additional material from the conversations.

00:00:47.380 –> 00:00:55.260
John Kennedy: Becoming a patron also gives you access to episode gear lists, episode previews and the opportunities to ask questions to upcoming guests amongst other things.

00:00:55.260 –> 00:01:01.100
John Kennedy: We’re incredibly grateful for the support of all of our patrons and we’re so pleased to hear how many of you have been enjoying the interviews.

00:01:01.100 –> 00:01:03.760
John Kennedy: So thank you to those of you that have joined us there.

00:01:03.760 –> 00:01:10.180
John Kennedy: Thank you also to our partners at Tape It, the iPhone recording app for musicians, more on them later in the episode.

00:01:10.180 –> 00:01:12.840
John Kennedy: But now without further ado, let’s get started.

00:01:18.726 –> 00:01:24.646
John Kennedy: Hello and welcome to Tape Notes, the podcast that looks behind the scenes at the magic of recording and producing music.

00:01:24.646 –> 00:01:31.646
John Kennedy: Every episode, we’ll be reuniting an artist and producer and talking through some of the highlights from their collaboration in the studio.

00:01:31.646 –> 00:01:38.086
John Kennedy: So join us as we lift the lid on the creative process and the inner workings of music production to see what lies beneath.

00:01:44.680 –> 00:01:57.360
John Kennedy: Hello, I’m John Kennedy, and joining me for this episode of Tape Notes is Lizzy McAlpine, with co-producers, co-writers and bandmates, Mason Stoops and Taylor Mackall, to talk about how they wrote, recorded and produced the album, Older.

00:01:57.360 –> 00:02:02.280
John Kennedy: Lizzy McAlpine is a singer, songwriter and record producer from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.

00:02:02.280 –> 00:02:10.260
John Kennedy: Having immersed herself in music throughout her high school years, in 2018, aged only 18, Lizzy released her debut EP, Indigo.

00:02:10.260 –> 00:02:17.500
John Kennedy: Centered around acoustic sounds, the eight-track record was praised for its simple yet poetic lyrics, along with Lizzy’s impressive vocals.

00:02:17.500 –> 00:02:34.800
John Kennedy: Beginning to gain more attention online for her covers on platforms like SoundCloud and Instagram, after a year of studying at Berkeley College of Music, she subsequently left to pursue music full-time, releasing her debut album in 2020, Give Me a Minute, produced by Philip Beatherington, Aaron Ebbage and Dylan Witherow.

00:02:34.800 –> 00:02:46.260
John Kennedy: In 2022, Lizzy’s widely successful second studio album, Five Seconds Flat, was released to critical acclaim with the platinum-selling track, Ceilings, becoming a viral sensation around the world.

00:02:46.260 –> 00:03:01.680
John Kennedy: Following collaborations with Noah Cahan, Niall Horan, Phineas and Jacob Collier, in 2024, Lizzy released her third studio album, Older, and the deluxe version, Older and Wiser, a record taking on topics of heartbreak and self-acceptance.

00:03:01.680 –> 00:03:05.760
John Kennedy: Mason Stoops is a guitarist, producer and songwriter from California.

00:03:05.760 –> 00:03:11.700
John Kennedy: Mason’s journey into music began when his mother bought him a guitar instead of the bass he had requested for Christmas.

00:03:11.700 –> 00:03:16.660
John Kennedy: However, he soon became deeply immersed in the instrument, honing his skills over the years.

00:03:16.660 –> 00:03:23.020
John Kennedy: Beginning his career as a musician after relocating to LA, he initially took on work performing on various TV soundtracks.

00:03:23.020 –> 00:03:32.720
John Kennedy: Over time, he expanded his repertoire, collaborating with a wide range of artists and embarking on numerous tours, leading him to work with artists including Katy Perry and Ryan Beatty.

00:03:32.720 –> 00:03:39.420
John Kennedy: Stepping more and more into the producer seat, Mason co-produced Older, writing and recording with his trusted touring bandmates.

00:03:40.420 –> 00:03:48.560
John Kennedy: Taylor Mackall is an LA-based composer, producer and multi-instrumentalist, primarily covering piano, ukulele and pretty much everything in between.

00:03:48.560 –> 00:03:54.460
John Kennedy: With work spanning all corners of the music industry, Taylor’s career has seen him share his talents on a variety of projects.

00:03:54.460 –> 00:04:05.960
John Kennedy: His composition work includes writing and performing on numerous soundtracks, including Disney’s 2023 film, Wish, and as an artist he has released three solo albums, the most recent of which, Reveries, arrived in 2020.

00:04:06.700 –> 00:04:12.400
John Kennedy: As an in-demand session musician, Taylor has performed and toured with artists including Marcus Mumford and Joni Mitchell.

00:04:12.400 –> 00:04:21.340
John Kennedy: Regularly working alongside Mason, his most recent work in the studio has been collaborating on Older, bringing his skills to the studio and the road with Lizzy and the band.

00:04:21.340 –> 00:04:25.600
John Kennedy: Today I’m at Miloco’s The Pool Studio and I’m joined by Lizzy, Mason and Taylor.

00:04:25.600 –> 00:04:29.560
John Kennedy: And what better way to start our conversation than by hearing something from the record.

00:04:29.560 –> 00:04:30.680
John Kennedy: This is Older.

00:05:48.648 –> 00:05:54.408
John Kennedy: It is Older by Lizzy McAlpine, the title track of the new album, the third album by Lizzy.

00:05:54.408 –> 00:05:59.968
John Kennedy: And I’m very pleased to say that we have come to The Pool at Miloco Studios to talk to Lizzy McAlpine in person.

00:05:59.968 –> 00:06:00.708
John Kennedy: Hello, Lizzy.

00:06:00.708 –> 00:06:02.128
Lizzy McAlpine: Hi again.

00:06:02.128 –> 00:06:07.988
John Kennedy: Yeah, it’s great to see you in the flesh, as it were, because we did an episode of Tape Notes before.

00:06:07.988 –> 00:06:09.068
John Kennedy: That was online.

00:06:09.068 –> 00:06:11.308
John Kennedy: But to have you here in person is fantastic.

00:06:11.308 –> 00:06:12.768
John Kennedy: And you’ve brought some friends with you.

00:06:12.768 –> 00:06:13.408
Lizzy McAlpine: I have.

00:06:13.408 –> 00:06:14.428
John Kennedy: We’ve got Mason Stoops.

00:06:14.428 –> 00:06:15.148
John Kennedy: Hello, Mason.

00:06:15.148 –> 00:06:15.268
Mason Stoops: Hi.

00:06:17.688 –> 00:06:18.788
John Kennedy: And we’ve got Taylor Mackall.

00:06:18.788 –> 00:06:19.508
John Kennedy: Hello, Taylor.

00:06:19.508 –> 00:06:19.988
Taylor Mackall: Hello.

00:06:19.988 –> 00:06:21.968
John Kennedy: And so you’re in the midst of a tour.

00:06:21.968 –> 00:06:22.668
Lizzy McAlpine: Yes.

00:06:22.668 –> 00:06:23.028
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

00:06:23.028 –> 00:06:24.628
John Kennedy: So where have you played already?

00:06:24.628 –> 00:06:26.648
Lizzy McAlpine: Oh, gosh.

00:06:26.668 –> 00:06:28.208
Lizzy McAlpine: Antwerp.

00:06:28.208 –> 00:06:29.228
Lizzy McAlpine: The other one.

00:06:29.248 –> 00:06:31.248
Lizzy McAlpine: Amsterdam.

00:06:31.248 –> 00:06:32.048
Lizzy McAlpine: Berlin.

00:06:32.048 –> 00:06:33.508
Lizzy McAlpine: Cologne.

00:06:33.508 –> 00:06:34.048
John Kennedy: Paris.

00:06:34.048 –> 00:06:35.148
Lizzy McAlpine: Paris.

00:06:35.148 –> 00:06:36.248
Lizzy McAlpine: Am I missing any?

00:06:36.248 –> 00:06:36.708
Lizzy McAlpine: Right.

00:06:36.708 –> 00:06:37.908
John Kennedy: So you’ve been to some lovely places.

00:06:37.908 –> 00:06:38.968
Lizzy McAlpine: We’re halfway through.

00:06:38.968 –> 00:06:43.368
John Kennedy: Halfway through, and you’re about to play in London, but you found time to talk to us, which is very exciting.

00:06:43.848 –> 00:06:48.008
John Kennedy: To find out how you created Older, the album.

00:06:48.008 –> 00:06:50.948
John Kennedy: Before we look at the first song, what did you want to do?

00:06:50.948 –> 00:06:53.228
John Kennedy: What was different with this new record?

00:06:53.228 –> 00:06:53.748
Lizzy McAlpine: Oh, my God.

00:06:53.748 –> 00:06:54.948
Lizzy McAlpine: So many things.

00:06:54.948 –> 00:07:00.068
Lizzy McAlpine: Well, I started this album actually, it was like three years in the making.

00:07:00.068 –> 00:07:30.788
Lizzy McAlpine: I started it before I found these lovely boys and the rest of the band, and we had almost finished it, and then something wasn’t feeling right, and I pivoted and wanted to find different collaborators just to make it sound more human, because I was making the album how I’ve always made an album, which is piecing things together basically, and we would have session players come in and play in separate rooms on different days, sometimes on Zoom.

00:07:30.788 –> 00:07:38.528
Lizzy McAlpine: It was just like, I mean, not over Zoom, but they did it remotely, and for these songs, it was not feeling right.

00:07:40.008 –> 00:07:45.608
Lizzy McAlpine: So then I was kind of like in a gray area period where I didn’t have any direction.

00:07:45.608 –> 00:07:52.108
Lizzy McAlpine: I didn’t know what to do, and I went to a show and I saw the band play, and I was like, this is what I need.

00:07:52.108 –> 00:07:58.468
Lizzy McAlpine: And so then we made the whole album together, and I really just wanted it to sound human.

00:07:58.468 –> 00:08:05.508
Lizzy McAlpine: I wanted it to be real and live and as much as possible, and I wanted it to feel like a band album.

00:08:05.508 –> 00:08:09.108
Lizzy McAlpine: Like I wanted it to feel like we were all just sitting in a room playing music.

00:08:09.168 –> 00:08:09.728
John Kennedy: Fantastic.

00:08:09.728 –> 00:08:11.668
Lizzy McAlpine: Very different from how I’ve made an album before.

00:08:11.668 –> 00:08:12.568
John Kennedy: And that’s how it sounds.

00:08:13.348 –> 00:08:19.368
John Kennedy: And it also feels really intimate, like you’re in the room with the band at that moment when you’re listening, which is fantastic.

00:08:19.368 –> 00:08:25.428
John Kennedy: And the first song we’re going to look at is The Elevator, which is actually the opening track to the album.

00:08:25.428 –> 00:08:30.908
John Kennedy: So maybe you could give us a blast to the master, Lizzy, and we can hear what the song ended up sounding like.

00:08:30.908 –> 00:08:31.408
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, great.

00:09:53.430 –> 00:09:55.850
John Kennedy: It is The Elevator by Lizzy McAlpine.

00:09:55.850 –> 00:10:01.970
John Kennedy: And listening to that, I was able to watch Taylor and Mason air play some of those parts.

00:10:01.970 –> 00:10:03.950
Taylor Mackall: As we want to do.

00:10:05.590 –> 00:10:08.110
John Kennedy: Are you two of the key players on that particular track?

00:10:08.550 –> 00:10:10.290
Mason Stoops: It’s the whole band.

00:10:10.290 –> 00:10:15.090
Mason Stoops: No one can take, in fact, if anyone’s the key player, it should be Libro.

00:10:15.090 –> 00:10:16.270
Taylor Mackall: Michael Liberimento.

00:10:16.270 –> 00:10:19.330
Mason Stoops: Because he played bass and drums at the same time.

00:10:19.590 –> 00:10:20.230
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

00:10:20.230 –> 00:10:22.910
Taylor Mackall: Because our drummer hadn’t gotten to town yet.

00:10:22.910 –> 00:10:26.950
Lizzy McAlpine: This is the first day of working on this album with the band.

00:10:26.950 –> 00:10:28.810
Lizzy McAlpine: And yeah, we didn’t have a drummer yet.

00:10:28.810 –> 00:10:34.030
Lizzy McAlpine: So Libro was just sat at the drums and also playing bass with crossed arms.

00:10:34.030 –> 00:10:35.510
Lizzy McAlpine: It was pretty crazy.

00:10:35.510 –> 00:10:35.870
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:10:35.870 –> 00:10:46.210
Mason Stoops: Because we truly went into it not, I mean, the plan was to not really have a plan and just communicate and work as a band on these songs.

00:10:46.650 –> 00:10:58.370
Mason Stoops: So the two days that we spent like setting up the studio, the whole time in my head, it’s like, yeah, chair here, amp here, I don’t know what I’m doing, table here.

00:10:58.370 –> 00:11:00.010
Mason Stoops: It’s like we really didn’t know what to expect.

00:11:00.010 –> 00:11:07.810
Mason Stoops: And so this first song, especially with like, we’re not even gonna have a drummer, but we’re scheduled to start today was like, I’m curious how we’re gonna do this.

00:11:07.810 –> 00:11:13.530
Taylor Mackall: And especially that one, I feel like listening to that, it’s really a product of like no thinking whatsoever.

00:11:13.530 –> 00:11:17.330
Taylor Mackall: We were just setting up really, okay, maybe we should try this one, check it out.

00:11:17.330 –> 00:11:19.030
Taylor Mackall: That’s basically what we just heard.

00:11:19.090 –> 00:11:21.670
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, we did like, not that many takes.

00:11:21.670 –> 00:11:24.510
Lizzy McAlpine: No, we did like maybe four or five.

00:11:24.510 –> 00:11:27.710
Mason Stoops: Yeah, just live together in a circle in the room.

00:11:27.710 –> 00:11:32.250
Mason Stoops: Maybe like a court, I mean, such a small room, everybody could probably touch each other’s shoulders.

00:11:32.250 –> 00:11:36.090
Lizzy McAlpine: And I’m pretty sure I was recording vocals also in that room.

00:11:36.090 –> 00:11:37.250
Lizzy McAlpine: I didn’t redo them, I don’t think.

00:11:37.830 –> 00:11:47.050
Mason Stoops: No, no, so there’s I mean, and this is a theme really for the whole record was really leaning in to bleed, leaning into letting sounds interact with other sounds.

00:11:47.050 –> 00:11:52.430
Mason Stoops: I get this, the motive of wanting to keep everything very clean, very isolated.

00:11:52.430 –> 00:12:02.650
Mason Stoops: And we kind of threw that away from the beginning with the idea of like letting the sound be us, you know, in each other’s spaces.

00:12:03.490 –> 00:12:09.090
Mason Stoops: And I think that also helps really that that comment you made earlier about really hearing the room.

00:12:09.090 –> 00:12:16.050
Mason Stoops: I think that’s a big part of it too, is letting the room be an instrument as well and that intimacy.

00:12:16.050 –> 00:12:19.510
Mason Stoops: So there’s, if you isolate the drums, you’re going to hear the guitars.

00:12:19.510 –> 00:12:22.450
Mason Stoops: And if you isolate the guitars, you’re going to hear the drums.

00:12:22.450 –> 00:12:25.790
Mason Stoops: And if you isolate Lizzy’s vocals, you’re going to hear everything.

00:12:25.790 –> 00:12:30.370
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, it was tough to record that way for me because I couldn’t really hear myself when the whole band would come in.

00:12:30.370 –> 00:12:34.510
Lizzy McAlpine: But this song in particular was kind of easy because I don’t really sing when the whole band is in.

00:12:34.510 –> 00:12:38.290
Lizzy McAlpine: So I was just singing and everyone was playing.

00:12:38.530 –> 00:12:41.190
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s just such a cool way to do it that I had never done before.

00:12:41.190 –> 00:12:43.730
Lizzy McAlpine: And it was really, like this is the first thing we did.

00:12:43.730 –> 00:12:45.490
Lizzy McAlpine: And I was like, okay, like I made the right choice.

00:12:45.490 –> 00:12:47.670
Lizzy McAlpine: Like this is, this is exactly what I wanted.

00:12:47.670 –> 00:12:48.910
Lizzy McAlpine: It was really affirming.

00:12:49.210 –> 00:12:51.110
John Kennedy: And the song was already written?

00:12:51.110 –> 00:12:52.190
Lizzy McAlpine: Yes.

00:12:52.190 –> 00:12:54.490
John Kennedy: Had the band heard it at that point?

00:12:54.970 –> 00:12:58.750
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, we had a day, the three of us and Jesse, our engineer.

00:12:59.230 –> 00:12:59.870
Mason Stoops: Shout out to Jesse.

00:12:59.870 –> 00:13:01.950
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, shout out to Jesse.

00:13:01.950 –> 00:13:13.150
Lizzy McAlpine: We all listened through to every song, like before we got in with the band and kind of made notes and talked about how we, kind of what we thought for the song.

00:13:13.150 –> 00:13:19.230
Lizzy McAlpine: So they had heard it, but I don’t think we were like really listening to it that much.

00:13:19.230 –> 00:13:24.250
Lizzy McAlpine: We were trying to just like hear the form and then kind of take it into our own lane.

00:13:24.250 –> 00:13:29.030
Lizzy McAlpine: Cause I had, I had basically produced the whole album before we got in with the band.

00:13:29.030 –> 00:13:34.570
Lizzy McAlpine: So I was playing them like basically produced out songs already that I wanted to change.

00:13:34.570 –> 00:13:41.090
Lizzy McAlpine: Some of them kind of stayed the same, but for the most part, this one in particular, I was like, we got to take this in a different direction.

00:13:41.090 –> 00:13:43.850
Lizzy McAlpine: Like this version I’m playing you is not what I wanted to sound like.

00:13:43.850 –> 00:13:47.010
Lizzy McAlpine: So yeah, we were kind of like, let’s just see what we can do.

00:13:47.010 –> 00:13:50.030
John Kennedy: So that’s interesting, because often we listen to demos here.

00:13:50.450 –> 00:13:53.270
John Kennedy: And that’s often the first iteration of a song.

00:13:53.270 –> 00:14:00.450
John Kennedy: Are you able to play us any of those, those other versions that you felt were finished, but you decided to scrap?

00:14:00.450 –> 00:14:01.610
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, I can.

00:14:01.610 –> 00:14:03.790
Lizzy McAlpine: And it’s so weird to listen back to this.

00:14:03.790 –> 00:14:06.050
Lizzy McAlpine: I honestly haven’t listened to it in a while.

00:14:06.050 –> 00:14:11.350
Lizzy McAlpine: But this was, so this song, initially Come Down Soon was supposed to be the first track on the album.

00:14:11.350 –> 00:14:14.710
Lizzy McAlpine: And it just like didn’t really feel right to just come in with that.

00:14:14.710 –> 00:14:17.910
Lizzy McAlpine: So I wanted to create like a little intro track.

00:14:17.910 –> 00:14:30.630
Lizzy McAlpine: And in the original version of Come Down Soon that I did with the last producer, there was a synth part that was like underneath one section of the song that we took and cut up and made it into the elevator.

00:14:30.630 –> 00:14:34.110
Lizzy McAlpine: And then I just like wrote a little thing over it to be the intro.

00:14:34.110 –> 00:14:35.750
Lizzy McAlpine: So this is like, this is that.

00:14:35.750 –> 00:14:37.370
Lizzy McAlpine: Oh God, I’m nervous.

00:14:37.370 –> 00:14:37.570
Lizzy McAlpine: Okay.

00:15:38.251 –> 00:15:40.951
Lizzy McAlpine: It sounds like it’s the intro to a different album.

00:15:40.951 –> 00:15:44.011
John Kennedy: Yeah, but it’s a very different sound world, isn’t it?

00:15:44.011 –> 00:15:52.871
John Kennedy: When you can hear the elements that are maybe the same, no, obviously some of the words and then that change there, but a whole other sound world that you would have introduced us to.

00:15:52.871 –> 00:15:58.451
John Kennedy: So you obviously created that, and then that just didn’t feel right.

00:15:59.471 –> 00:16:02.311
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, I mean, it felt right at the time.

00:16:02.311 –> 00:16:16.071
Lizzy McAlpine: And then as we started building out some more of the songs, and I got to the end of that production time before I found the band, I was kind of like, okay, I don’t, I mean, because it just sounds like the intro to a different album.

00:16:16.071 –> 00:16:21.111
Lizzy McAlpine: And it sounds way more poppy than I wanted it to be.

00:16:21.111 –> 00:16:22.571
Lizzy McAlpine: And it’s just like, yeah, it did not feel right.

00:16:22.571 –> 00:16:25.591
Lizzy McAlpine: This was one of the ones that I knew I wanted to change when I got into the band.

00:16:26.891 –> 00:16:27.751
Mason Stoops: It sounds cool, though.

00:16:27.751 –> 00:16:36.151
Mason Stoops: I mean, I remember the first time we started listening through the previous version of the record that you’d made with Ryan.

00:16:36.311 –> 00:16:40.451
Mason Stoops: And I have a lot of respect for Ryan’s work and his sounds.

00:16:40.451 –> 00:16:45.071
Mason Stoops: And so it was intimidating, I guess, for us to be like, this is a complete record in a way.

00:16:45.071 –> 00:16:46.291
Mason Stoops: You could release this.

00:16:46.291 –> 00:16:48.251
Mason Stoops: And those sounds are beautiful.

00:16:48.251 –> 00:16:51.031
Mason Stoops: I wish I knew how to make a record that sounded like that.

00:16:51.031 –> 00:16:53.091
Mason Stoops: I just don’t, period.

00:16:53.811 –> 00:16:55.351
Mason Stoops: I know.

00:16:55.351 –> 00:17:07.851
Mason Stoops: And so the task of Lizzy is feeling a very different thing and us as a band meeting her halfway, felt like Bob Dylan with the plugs on Leitermann or something like that.

00:17:07.851 –> 00:17:12.051
Mason Stoops: It was just such a different, what is he doing with them?

00:17:12.051 –> 00:17:14.671
Mason Stoops: And how are we going to…

00:17:14.671 –> 00:17:17.491
Mason Stoops: Yeah, it’s cool hearing it.

00:17:17.491 –> 00:17:20.651
Mason Stoops: It’s like, oh man, they’re great sounds.

00:17:20.651 –> 00:17:28.451
Mason Stoops: But knowing, especially knowing you now and knowing what you were going for, it makes so much sense why we ended up doing things the way we did it.

00:17:28.451 –> 00:17:32.291
Mason Stoops: And I’m very grateful that we got to do it the way that we did it.

00:17:32.291 –> 00:17:32.731
Lizzy McAlpine: Me too.

00:17:32.731 –> 00:17:38.111
Lizzy McAlpine: I mean, I could have released the album how it was before I found the band and it would have sounded great.

00:17:38.111 –> 00:17:40.091
Lizzy McAlpine: They were great tracks.

00:17:40.091 –> 00:17:45.071
Lizzy McAlpine: It just, I knew that I wanted to go in the direction of having it be live.

00:17:45.071 –> 00:17:49.851
Lizzy McAlpine: And I knew that that wasn’t really like, I knew it wasn’t the finished product.

00:17:49.851 –> 00:17:50.831
Lizzy McAlpine: I just knew it in my gut.

00:17:50.951 –> 00:17:53.391
Lizzy McAlpine: I was like, I need to make this.

00:17:53.391 –> 00:17:55.771
Lizzy McAlpine: I mean, because I already spent so much time working on this album.

00:17:55.771 –> 00:17:57.771
Lizzy McAlpine: I was like, I can’t just like put it out.

00:17:57.771 –> 00:18:02.051
Lizzy McAlpine: Like, I need to really make sure that it’s exactly what I want it to be.

00:18:02.051 –> 00:18:02.811
Lizzy McAlpine: Because like, why not?

00:18:02.811 –> 00:18:04.031
Lizzy McAlpine: Why wouldn’t I do that?

00:18:04.031 –> 00:18:09.871
Lizzy McAlpine: But yeah, I mean, so many songs are a couple of the songs on the album.

00:18:09.871 –> 00:18:15.791
Lizzy McAlpine: We kept a lot of what we did with Ryan because I just like was really attached to it and really loved it.

00:18:15.791 –> 00:18:20.071
Lizzy McAlpine: And we just added like some of our own little things in there or like took some stuff out.

00:18:20.511 –> 00:18:25.091
Lizzy McAlpine: But for the most part, we just like re-recorded a lot of it.

00:18:25.091 –> 00:18:36.351
Mason Stoops: I mean, pretty much the whole album ended up being like us recording our versions, you know, and us taking just, here’s us, here’s how we would do it in this room.

00:18:36.351 –> 00:18:44.671
Mason Stoops: Here’s, and then kind of left it to Lizzy to combine those worlds and make the, you know, the space that she was hearing in her head.

00:18:44.671 –> 00:18:46.631
Mason Stoops: Yeah, which was tough.

00:18:46.631 –> 00:18:56.631
Lizzy McAlpine: It was hard for me because I had had, I had this whole album that was basically finished and I was so attached to some of these songs and, and like, what’s one of them that was really hard?

00:18:56.631 –> 00:19:00.851
Lizzy McAlpine: All Falls Down was tough because it was done and I really, really loved it.

00:19:00.851 –> 00:19:05.571
Lizzy McAlpine: And then we were trying to like make our own version of it with the band and it was so hard.

00:19:05.571 –> 00:19:07.331
Lizzy McAlpine: I was like, I don’t know.

00:19:07.331 –> 00:19:08.491
Lizzy McAlpine: Like, I don’t know if I like this.

00:19:08.491 –> 00:19:09.491
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t know what to do.

00:19:09.491 –> 00:19:15.791
Lizzy McAlpine: It was like, that happened for a couple songs and it was, it was hard to just trust the process and also trust myself.

00:19:15.891 –> 00:19:20.231
Lizzy McAlpine: And at the end of the day, it was like, I can kind of do whatever I want.

00:19:20.231 –> 00:19:25.651
Lizzy McAlpine: Because it’s my album, which I don’t know why I like didn’t have that thought in my head before.

00:19:25.651 –> 00:19:29.851
Lizzy McAlpine: I think it’s just because I’ve, I mean, I’m a woman in the music industry.

00:19:29.851 –> 00:19:36.071
Lizzy McAlpine: Like a lot of people, you know, aren’t receptive to my ideas a lot of times.

00:19:36.071 –> 00:19:40.331
Lizzy McAlpine: And a lot of times it feels like I am taking a back seat and someone else is in control.

00:19:40.331 –> 00:19:44.691
Lizzy McAlpine: And this was the first time where I really felt like I was in control of my own stuff.

00:19:44.811 –> 00:19:47.291
Lizzy McAlpine: And I kind of had to, there was a learning curve, definitely.

00:19:47.291 –> 00:19:49.251
Lizzy McAlpine: I was like, oh, I can just do whatever I want.

00:19:49.251 –> 00:19:51.191
Lizzy McAlpine: Like if I want to use this old version, I can.

00:19:51.191 –> 00:19:51.551
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:19:51.551 –> 00:19:53.491
Lizzy McAlpine: And no one’s going to be upset or like.

00:19:53.491 –> 00:19:59.291
Mason Stoops: No, we loved, I mean, any opportunity we could to, I know you’re right here, but I’m going to be tenured not for a second.

00:19:59.291 –> 00:20:01.951
Mason Stoops: Like Lizzy has such strong ideas.

00:20:01.951 –> 00:20:05.711
Mason Stoops: And the reality is like she really doesn’t need us.

00:20:05.711 –> 00:20:10.731
Mason Stoops: The demos that she’s shown us, what the arrangement she’s come up with and the parts that she comes up with.

00:20:10.731 –> 00:20:13.671
Mason Stoops: I mean, that’s why we were so strong headed about keeping.

00:20:14.111 –> 00:20:15.051
Taylor Mackall: You forced me to.

00:20:15.051 –> 00:20:18.031
Mason Stoops: Yeah, the way, because that’s the demo that Lizzy showed us.

00:20:18.031 –> 00:20:24.331
Mason Stoops: And that was also like kind of the moment when we were first listening through the record, that when we heard that we were blown away.

00:20:24.331 –> 00:20:28.831
Mason Stoops: It was like a McCartney situation of like, what is how, who did this?

00:20:28.831 –> 00:20:30.591
Mason Stoops: And she’s like, it’s just me in my house.

00:20:30.591 –> 00:20:31.711
Lizzy McAlpine: Cause I had a different version of that.

00:20:31.711 –> 00:20:35.631
Lizzy McAlpine: We had produced that out with like string, a full string arrangement and like, it was crazy.

00:20:35.631 –> 00:20:37.711
Lizzy McAlpine: And then, and then when we were-

00:20:37.711 –> 00:20:38.211
John Kennedy: Which track?

00:20:38.331 –> 00:20:39.111
Lizzy McAlpine: You forced me to.

00:20:39.531 –> 00:20:39.831
John Kennedy: Oh, right.

00:20:39.831 –> 00:20:40.171
John Kennedy: Okay.

00:20:40.171 –> 00:20:44.591
Lizzy McAlpine: And then when we were listening through, I was like, I’m just going to play my demo.

00:20:44.591 –> 00:20:46.591
Lizzy McAlpine: Cause I feel like it’s kind of cool.

00:20:46.591 –> 00:20:48.131
Lizzy McAlpine: And they were like, what the hell?

00:20:48.131 –> 00:20:48.891
Mason Stoops: That was the moment.

00:20:48.891 –> 00:20:54.431
Mason Stoops: That was kind of the song and the moment where we realized what this record could be and who we were working with.

00:20:54.431 –> 00:21:03.171
Mason Stoops: And so really for us as the band, it was any opportunity we could to encourage and support Lizzy’s, you know, her ideas and her taste, you know, is so dialed.

00:21:03.171 –> 00:21:06.751
Mason Stoops: She really does know what works for her and what doesn’t.

00:21:06.931 –> 00:21:22.591
Mason Stoops: And that, like going down that journey and that rabbit hole with her was the most rewarding part, I think, for us, because it wasn’t, it just wasn’t like typical sessions where you’re kind of just throwing paint randomly at a wall and then later an engineer and a producer cleans it up on a laptop.

00:21:22.591 –> 00:21:33.611
Mason Stoops: It was really communicating as a band, really communicating and really asking Lizzy, really trying to get to the bottom of what emotionally needed to be there and especially what emotionally didn’t need to be there.

00:21:33.611 –> 00:21:38.111
Mason Stoops: There’s a lot of songs that are just stripped back or just Lizzy and I on guitar.

00:21:38.111 –> 00:21:42.011
Mason Stoops: I mean, and going back to the elevator too, it’s really only a few elements.

00:21:42.011 –> 00:21:43.911
Mason Stoops: There’s so many cool ones.

00:21:43.911 –> 00:21:52.311
Mason Stoops: One of my favorite sounds on the whole record that ended up being kind of a theme defining sound was we call it the foghorn.

00:21:52.311 –> 00:21:53.251
Lizzy McAlpine: Let me solo it.

00:21:53.251 –> 00:21:54.031
Mason Stoops: You should find it.

00:21:54.031 –> 00:21:54.671
Lizzy McAlpine: We can play it.

00:22:10.095 –> 00:22:25.235
Mason Stoops: What it was and what’s cool about it, well, the sound of it is Taylor’s Melotron going into a very small little projector amplifier made by Austin Hooks, which was then going into an even smaller speaker, kind of like the size of like a coaster.

00:22:25.235 –> 00:22:29.275
Mason Stoops: Or we did the whole Melotron on the record, actually, through that speaker.

00:22:29.275 –> 00:22:32.055
John Kennedy: And then is that mic directly or?

00:22:32.055 –> 00:22:33.855
Mason Stoops: Yeah, yeah, we just put a mic right up in front.

00:22:33.855 –> 00:22:37.835
Mason Stoops: It’s, yeah, it’s, we just had a 57, usually, on that little speaker.

00:22:38.615 –> 00:22:42.375
Mason Stoops: But in that instance, it’s the, was it the trombone setting?

00:22:42.375 –> 00:22:43.755
Taylor Mackall: Trombone setting on the Melotron.

00:22:43.755 –> 00:22:45.255
Mason Stoops: But with the amp just cranked.

00:22:45.255 –> 00:22:45.875
Taylor Mackall: Fully cranked.

00:22:45.875 –> 00:22:48.895
Mason Stoops: The speaker is just holding on for dear life.

00:22:48.895 –> 00:22:54.975
Mason Stoops: And the idea spiritually, I mean, this is, there’s a theme for this record.

00:22:54.975 –> 00:23:05.395
Mason Stoops: And Lizzy’s kind of entering this, what would be a very intense relationship, despite it was only like, we’re gonna say three months, right, Lizzy?

00:23:05.395 –> 00:23:06.655
Taylor Mackall: Almost a year, I feel like.

00:23:06.655 –> 00:23:07.255
Mason Stoops: Oh, it’s a year.

00:23:07.655 –> 00:23:09.275
Taylor Mackall: Or this relationship was half a year, right?

00:23:09.275 –> 00:23:10.675
Lizzy McAlpine: Oh, the relationship there was the other half.

00:23:10.675 –> 00:23:11.615
Mason Stoops: Yes, exactly.

00:23:11.615 –> 00:23:13.835
Lizzy McAlpine: Oh, yeah, it lasted for a month and a half.

00:23:13.835 –> 00:23:14.315
Mason Stoops: There we go.

00:23:14.315 –> 00:23:16.755
Lizzy McAlpine: But then it was like the next four years on and off.

00:23:16.755 –> 00:23:21.595
Mason Stoops: But the idea, just this kind of, we were entering the storm at the beginning of this record.

00:23:21.595 –> 00:23:31.055
Mason Stoops: And that’s kind of, it’s like this, the band entering, it’s just like these waves crashing in, this feeling of being overwhelmed and excited and kind of not in control.

00:23:31.055 –> 00:23:39.335
Mason Stoops: There’s no handrails, it’s just, and this foghorn just kind of being this warning signal that like you’re getting close to dangerous territory.

00:23:39.335 –> 00:23:48.535
Mason Stoops: And then the kind of the beautiful, I guess, reprise of it is at the end of Vortex, which was going to be the album name before it was older.

00:23:48.535 –> 00:23:55.835
Mason Stoops: At the end of Vortex, which is the closing song on the record in the outro, the feeling was kind of this like cleansing storm.

00:23:55.835 –> 00:24:02.335
Mason Stoops: It’s like you’re now getting through the other side of, you know, kind of the darkness and that time in your life and moving on.

00:24:02.335 –> 00:24:10.715
Mason Stoops: And as like the ships going away, we brought the Foghorn back on that last song and it kind of just disappears into the ether as like the ship is leaving.

00:24:10.715 –> 00:24:12.775
Taylor Mackall: And just those two.

00:24:12.775 –> 00:24:22.615
Mason Stoops: But you know, as dramatic and corny as we want to be about, you know, themes or all of that was, you know, a little a little mellotron through a tiny speaker.

00:24:22.615 –> 00:24:26.715
Taylor Mackall: Trombone setting, give some crunchy voicings and off you go.

00:24:26.715 –> 00:24:27.695
Taylor Mackall: That’s all I needed.

00:24:27.695 –> 00:24:28.615
Taylor Mackall: Yeah.

00:24:28.615 –> 00:24:38.235
John Kennedy: And when you use that technique a lot on the album, so there’s a line with panic attack, and then it’s almost as if the music reflects that feeling of a panic attack.

00:24:38.235 –> 00:24:41.475
John Kennedy: And it’s great the way you articulate that because it is so subtle.

00:24:41.475 –> 00:24:48.115
John Kennedy: And then these little bits, whereas it’s interesting how you managed to go quite loud, it never overpowers.

00:24:48.115 –> 00:25:04.995
Mason Stoops: It shouldn’t, you know, it’s, I mean, Lizzy really was going for, you know, this isn’t a black and white record, this is just the absolute sea of emotions that comes with being in a relationship, that is conflicting and exciting at the same time.

00:25:04.995 –> 00:25:09.475
Mason Stoops: And so these sounds like should almost agree and disagree at the same time.

00:25:09.475 –> 00:25:16.275
Mason Stoops: And so that kind of goes back to that bleed thing we’re talking about too, is not so, not going for clean, not going for perfect.

00:25:16.275 –> 00:25:26.015
Mason Stoops: Yeah, but certainly going for raw and certainly going for, you know, what felt emotionally right in those moments and capturing that while it was there and real.

00:25:26.015 –> 00:25:30.515
John Kennedy: Maybe you could talk us through the elements that are there as they come in.

00:25:30.855 –> 00:25:32.475
John Kennedy: No, that’d be great.

00:25:32.475 –> 00:25:32.955
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:25:32.955 –> 00:25:36.295
Mason Stoops: I mean, do we have like electric guitar isolated at all?

00:25:36.295 –> 00:25:37.315
Mason Stoops: I’m curious.

00:25:37.315 –> 00:25:38.555
Lizzy McAlpine: Guitars.

00:25:38.555 –> 00:25:40.895
Mason Stoops: What’s happening there?

00:25:40.895 –> 00:25:41.775
Mason Stoops: Oh, that’s.

00:25:41.775 –> 00:25:43.955
Taylor Mackall: Flap steel, pedal steel.

00:25:47.835 –> 00:25:51.695
John Kennedy: So is the pedal steel played by one of the Nuffer brothers?

00:25:51.695 –> 00:25:52.055
Mason Stoops: Correct.

00:25:52.055 –> 00:25:52.375
Mason Stoops: Yes.

00:25:52.375 –> 00:25:52.695
John Kennedy: And so.

00:25:52.695 –> 00:25:53.255
Taylor Mackall: Very good.

00:25:53.255 –> 00:25:53.655
Mason Stoops: Thailand.

00:25:54.555 –> 00:25:57.055
John Kennedy: And you recorded Nuffer Ranch.

00:25:57.275 –> 00:25:58.495
John Kennedy: This is their pad.

00:25:58.855 –> 00:25:59.335
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:25:59.335 –> 00:26:03.095
Mason Stoops: You’ve been telling me for so long, you should come by my studio.

00:26:03.095 –> 00:26:05.875
Mason Stoops: And I was always just like, no.

00:26:05.875 –> 00:26:12.515
Mason Stoops: Like, you know, we, you know, especially for a project like this, I think I had to drop off a keyboard or something at some point.

00:26:12.515 –> 00:26:13.575
Mason Stoops: And I saw the space.

00:26:13.575 –> 00:26:14.795
Mason Stoops: It’s like, this is so cool.

00:26:14.795 –> 00:26:18.055
Mason Stoops: And it’s just super isolated and just kind of tucked away.

00:26:18.055 –> 00:26:24.775
Mason Stoops: And I felt like, you know, especially when we first were talking about doing the record, there was so many big studios thrown around and that would have been exciting.

00:26:24.775 –> 00:26:33.515
Mason Stoops: And the more I talked with Lizzy, the more we felt like somewhere a little unusual or off the beaten path and especially comfortable.

00:26:33.515 –> 00:26:35.755
Mason Stoops: And Nuffer’s studio kind of presented itself.

00:26:35.755 –> 00:26:42.275
Mason Stoops: And it was just like great one room, little control room, a couch, a dog.

00:26:42.275 –> 00:26:43.015
Taylor Mackall: It was…

00:26:43.015 –> 00:26:43.755
Taylor Mackall: From all of us.

00:26:43.835 –> 00:26:46.215
Mason Stoops: Yeah, we all lived like five minutes away from it too.

00:26:46.215 –> 00:26:48.215
Mason Stoops: So it just felt like home.

00:26:48.535 –> 00:26:51.975
John Kennedy: And the Nuffer brothers are experts in pedal steel or…

00:26:52.475 –> 00:26:54.815
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s just the one, the one of Tyler, yeah.

00:26:54.815 –> 00:26:55.775
Mason Stoops: Well, there’s a brother.

00:26:56.375 –> 00:26:57.255
Lizzy McAlpine: There is another brother.

00:26:57.255 –> 00:26:58.215
Lizzy McAlpine: He’s a guitarist.

00:26:58.215 –> 00:27:00.175
Mason Stoops: He’s a great guitar player and a great songwriter too.

00:27:00.175 –> 00:27:04.975
Mason Stoops: He actually stopped by the studio one day and so naturally we threw him on the record too.

00:27:05.355 –> 00:27:06.235
John Kennedy: So he’s on there.

00:27:06.235 –> 00:27:06.895
Mason Stoops: He’s there.

00:27:06.895 –> 00:27:07.875
Mason Stoops: He’s real.

00:27:07.875 –> 00:27:10.475
Lizzy McAlpine: But it’s Tyler’s house, Tyler’s studio.

00:27:10.475 –> 00:27:12.855
Lizzy McAlpine: And yeah, he’s all things pedal steel.

00:27:12.855 –> 00:27:13.295
Mason Stoops: Right.

00:27:13.295 –> 00:27:15.615
John Kennedy: So because there’s a lot of pedal steel on this record.

00:27:15.615 –> 00:27:16.295
John Kennedy: Yeah.

00:27:16.295 –> 00:27:18.895
John Kennedy: And it seems like a vital ingredient.

00:27:18.895 –> 00:27:19.335
John Kennedy: So that’s all.

00:27:20.175 –> 00:27:22.975
Lizzy McAlpine: The pedal steel and Ryan Richter plays lap steel.

00:27:22.975 –> 00:27:24.415
Mason Stoops: The two of those together.

00:27:24.415 –> 00:27:26.355
Lizzy McAlpine: Those were really like important.

00:27:26.355 –> 00:27:28.535
Lizzy McAlpine: Also for our live show, they’re really important.

00:27:28.535 –> 00:27:29.055
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:27:29.055 –> 00:27:41.635
Mason Stoops: That formula initially came about on a tour we were doing previously where I was putting together a band and we needed to recreate a string orchestra live.

00:27:41.635 –> 00:27:51.335
Mason Stoops: But because of the way that I’m, I guess, cursed to like want to do things, I really wanted to do it with the band and not lean into tracks and also come up with maybe a more original approach to it.

00:27:52.215 –> 00:27:56.295
Mason Stoops: I’m a huge Western swing and country Western nut.

00:27:56.295 –> 00:28:01.755
Mason Stoops: So pedal steel and lap steel to me are like just core musical ingredients.

00:28:01.755 –> 00:28:16.595
Mason Stoops: Thinking about pedal steel as an approach for strings and especially combining it with lap steel to where it was like, you had all the low orchestral instruments being covered with Ryan Richter on lap steel and then Nuffer covering all the high string parts on pedal steel.

00:28:17.275 –> 00:28:28.035
Mason Stoops: And the two of those together and their imperfections and obviously being fretless, it’s actually more similar to a violin or a cello or they’re not too dissimilar.

00:28:28.035 –> 00:28:32.235
Mason Stoops: They’re just from a different angle, from a different perspective.

00:28:32.235 –> 00:28:39.835
Mason Stoops: And when Lizzy came to that show that we are all playing, that was us trying to recreate a string orchestra with the lap steel and pedal steel player.

00:28:39.835 –> 00:28:44.075
Mason Stoops: So naturally we brought that into the studio and then utilize that when we could.

00:28:44.075 –> 00:28:55.955
Mason Stoops: So there are such a dynamic, they really learned, especially as we got into the Deluxe record, how to work as a team and as a duo, and really interact and play and lean into each other.

00:28:55.955 –> 00:29:01.875
Mason Stoops: And it’s one of my favorite sounds that we’ve got on this record, and it’s so haunting and so beautiful.

00:29:02.075 –> 00:29:03.615
John Kennedy: Are they both on the elevator?

00:29:03.855 –> 00:29:05.515
John Kennedy: Yeah, they’re fighting each other.

00:29:05.515 –> 00:29:06.635
John Kennedy: You’re able to isolate there.

00:29:08.315 –> 00:29:13.175
Mason Stoops: So, that’s lap steel, and then pedal steel here, and then together.

00:29:13.175 –> 00:29:14.295
Lizzy McAlpine: And then Mason’s guitar also.

00:29:14.295 –> 00:29:19.455
Mason Stoops: And that’s an old Dan Electro Basics, which is another important instrument for the record.

00:29:19.455 –> 00:29:20.915
Mason Stoops: I played that on almost every song.

00:29:28.975 –> 00:29:29.755
Lizzy McAlpine: Where is it?

00:29:29.755 –> 00:29:31.395
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t know.

00:29:31.395 –> 00:29:32.255
Mason Stoops: It might be there.

00:29:32.255 –> 00:29:33.695
Lizzy McAlpine: In the drop.

00:29:33.695 –> 00:29:36.595
Taylor Mackall: Is that you hitting the pedal before the drop?

00:29:36.595 –> 00:29:37.715
Mason Stoops: That.

00:29:37.715 –> 00:29:38.175
Mason Stoops: I love that.

00:29:38.175 –> 00:29:39.235
Taylor Mackall: We were like, we gotta keep that.

00:29:39.235 –> 00:29:40.095
Taylor Mackall: That’s sick.

00:29:40.095 –> 00:29:48.675
Mason Stoops: That’s just the sound of me hitting a guitar pedal switch, but it kind of felt symbolic to leaning into that, that that moment was coming.

00:29:48.675 –> 00:29:49.695
John Kennedy: Can we hear that moment again?

00:29:49.695 –> 00:29:49.955
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:29:56.735 –> 00:29:57.075
John Kennedy: It’s great.

00:29:57.075 –> 00:30:04.775
John Kennedy: There’s so much drama in such a short space of time, and with such, it just feels super dramatic, and it’s quite a simple thing.

00:30:04.775 –> 00:30:05.695
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:30:05.695 –> 00:30:08.595
Mason Stoops: It’s kind of for the whole record, it was interesting.

00:30:08.595 –> 00:30:11.835
Mason Stoops: We didn’t lean on almost any traditional guitar.

00:30:11.835 –> 00:30:15.735
Mason Stoops: There’s not like big power chords filling the space that there normally would be.

00:30:15.735 –> 00:30:20.315
Mason Stoops: The bass six has a lot of power, but it’s kind of closer to Libro and the bass register.

00:30:20.315 –> 00:30:23.455
Mason Stoops: And then the lap steel and pedal steel are kind of in a different world.

00:30:23.455 –> 00:30:31.395
Mason Stoops: So it left that middle space really open in a nice way, which I think really gave Taylor and the Keys world like their dramatic space.

00:30:31.395 –> 00:30:35.995
Mason Stoops: So somehow, even though it’s not a small band, I think there’s six of us up there.

00:30:36.715 –> 00:30:38.595
Lizzy McAlpine: There’s seven plus me.

00:30:38.595 –> 00:30:38.995
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:30:38.995 –> 00:30:39.715
John Kennedy: Wow.

00:30:39.715 –> 00:30:43.675
Lizzy McAlpine: I always feel like there’s only six plus me equals seven.

00:30:43.675 –> 00:30:46.695
John Kennedy: And in the touring band, are there seven people on stage then?

00:30:46.695 –> 00:30:47.135
John Kennedy: Yeah.

00:30:47.135 –> 00:30:47.675
Mason Stoops: Same.

00:30:47.675 –> 00:30:50.115
John Kennedy: So it’s the same replicating the whole thing.

00:30:50.115 –> 00:30:53.895
Mason Stoops: Yeah, we brought out all the same gear and everything just to do the album live.

00:30:53.895 –> 00:30:56.635
Mason Stoops: We replicated Nuffer Ranch for the tour.

00:30:56.635 –> 00:30:58.415
Taylor Mackall: We even have a fun machine on stage.

00:30:58.415 –> 00:30:59.255
Mason Stoops: Yeah, we have the fun machine.

00:30:59.255 –> 00:31:00.435
Mason Stoops: Is fun machine on?

00:31:00.435 –> 00:31:00.895
Mason Stoops: I don’t think so.

00:31:00.895 –> 00:31:03.635
Mason Stoops: No, it’s not on the elevator.

00:31:03.635 –> 00:31:04.795
John Kennedy: I might inquire about that.

00:31:05.215 –> 00:31:06.295
Mason Stoops: Oh, man.

00:31:06.295 –> 00:31:07.015
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, we got stories.

00:31:07.015 –> 00:31:10.715
John Kennedy: We should probably move on to the next song.

00:31:10.715 –> 00:31:15.215
John Kennedy: Is there anything else we should hear from the elevator, or is another section that we haven’t heard that you could play us?

00:31:15.215 –> 00:31:16.795
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, I don’t know if there’s anything else.

00:31:16.795 –> 00:31:17.455
Mason Stoops: I mean-

00:31:17.455 –> 00:31:18.495
Lizzy McAlpine: Pretty simple song.

00:31:18.495 –> 00:31:19.315
John Kennedy: Yeah.

00:31:19.315 –> 00:31:21.215
John Kennedy: I mean, it’s only one minute 40.

00:31:21.215 –> 00:31:21.735
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

00:31:21.735 –> 00:31:25.915
John Kennedy: But it does set up the album really beautifully.

00:31:25.915 –> 00:31:30.655
John Kennedy: We’re going to go for a break in a minute, but maybe just we’ll hear another bit of the elevator to round it off.

00:31:30.655 –> 00:31:30.855
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:31:54.200 –> 00:31:57.520
Mason Stoops: Yeah, it’s really just lap steel, pedal steel, bass 6 with Taylor’s piano.

00:32:00.400 –> 00:32:03.680
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, I love the bass 6.

00:32:03.680 –> 00:32:04.420
Mason Stoops: The foot switch.

00:32:04.880 –> 00:32:09.280
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, Libra’s time field there, just sitting back.

00:32:10.440 –> 00:32:15.180
Mason Stoops: Yeah, apparently he’s known for doing drums and bass together a lot live.

00:32:15.180 –> 00:32:16.620
Mason Stoops: So when he was like, I could just do this.

00:32:17.100 –> 00:32:20.440
John Kennedy: So which parts of his body are doing what?

00:32:20.440 –> 00:32:22.020
Taylor Mackall: He can do anything with any limbs.

00:32:22.020 –> 00:32:30.260
Taylor Mackall: So I think he may have been doing either right hand key bass and then left hand.

00:32:30.260 –> 00:32:31.560
Mason Stoops: Yeah, doing the drums.

00:32:31.560 –> 00:32:34.240
Lizzy McAlpine: And then foot on the bass drum.

00:32:34.240 –> 00:32:35.040
Taylor Mackall: Right.

00:32:35.040 –> 00:32:38.620
Mason Stoops: Yeah, fully utilizing all four appendages.

00:32:38.620 –> 00:32:39.280
John Kennedy: Impressive.

00:32:39.280 –> 00:32:41.500
John Kennedy: Yeah, he’s a good person to have as part of the team.

00:32:41.840 –> 00:32:42.700
Mason Stoops: He’s essential.

00:32:42.700 –> 00:32:44.520
Taylor Mackall: Swiss Army Knife for sure.

00:32:44.520 –> 00:32:49.380
Mason Stoops: Everybody, I mean, it’s like an Ocean’s Eleven crew of people.

00:32:49.380 –> 00:32:50.500
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, it totally is.

00:32:50.500 –> 00:32:52.540
Taylor Mackall: I think it’s a great parallel.

00:32:52.540 –> 00:32:57.340
Mason Stoops: Yeah, very different, but brings like a unique set of skills and strengths.

00:32:57.340 –> 00:33:12.920
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, when Lizzy called us because she was at the concert where she met us, you know, it kind of setting up the record it just inspired us to do our thing and to not have to put on a hat or do like typical studio work.

00:33:12.920 –> 00:33:18.440
Taylor Mackall: It was cool because all we had to do was lean into who we individually were to make this collective sound.

00:33:18.440 –> 00:33:24.000
Taylor Mackall: And I can’t inspire me to go deeper and really want to like nail it and hit on the head for Lizzy.

00:33:24.000 –> 00:33:29.660
Taylor Mackall: And I think we all kind of stepped up to get as in touch with our voices as we could.

00:33:29.660 –> 00:33:31.660
Taylor Mackall: And this is such a cool way.

00:33:31.660 –> 00:33:35.740
Taylor Mackall: Looking back, it’s like, oh man, we were just starting to find it and we did.

00:33:35.740 –> 00:33:35.900
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:33:35.900 –> 00:33:36.660
Taylor Mackall: That’s sweet.

00:33:36.660 –> 00:33:37.140
John Kennedy: That’s great.

00:33:37.800 –> 00:33:38.260
John Kennedy: Right.

00:33:38.260 –> 00:33:39.280
John Kennedy: We’re going to take a break.

00:33:39.280 –> 00:33:42.520
John Kennedy: The next song we’re going to look at is Pushing It Down and Praying.

00:33:44.980 –> 00:33:53.220
John Kennedy: This episode is brought to you by Roland Cloud, a service giving you access to Roland’s suite of iconic software synthesizers, drum machines and sampled instruments.

00:33:53.220 –> 00:33:59.400
John Kennedy: And we have a special offer for any Tape Notes listeners, a 30-day free trial and 10% off membership.

00:33:59.400 –> 00:34:02.140
John Kennedy: And here to tell us more about it is Brandon from Roland.

00:34:02.140 –> 00:34:02.900
John Kennedy: Hi, Brandon.

00:34:02.900 –> 00:34:03.600
Brandon: Hello.

00:34:03.600 –> 00:34:04.280
Brandon: Thanks for having me.

00:34:04.840 –> 00:34:08.200
John Kennedy: Roland instruments are name-checked all the time by guests on Tape Notes.

00:34:08.200 –> 00:34:10.380
John Kennedy: What is the Roland Cloud?

00:34:10.380 –> 00:34:14.300
Brandon: Well, Roland Cloud really offers 50 years of sound.

00:34:14.300 –> 00:34:27.060
Brandon: So the kind of household names like 808, 909, Jupiter, Juno, Space Echo, all of these are available as meticulously modeled authentic instruments for a monthly or yearly price.

00:34:27.060 –> 00:34:29.800
John Kennedy: You can access Roland Cloud across three different tiers.

00:34:29.800 –> 00:34:31.280
John Kennedy: What do they include, Brandon?

00:34:31.700 –> 00:34:38.660
Brandon: Well, the core tier is $3 a month, and that gets you just basic access to some of the apps and sound content for hardware mainly.

00:34:38.660 –> 00:34:40.720
Brandon: The pro tier is where things start to get more interesting.

00:34:40.720 –> 00:34:46.960
Brandon: That’s at $10 a month, and that gets you our Zenology synthesizer, which kind of covers a little bit of the whole history.

00:34:46.960 –> 00:34:57.920
Brandon: But the real action is of the ultimate tier, and that gets you everything Roland Cloud has to offer, including DW Soundworks, drums, Earth Piano, all of the legendary synthesizers and effects.

00:34:57.920 –> 00:35:14.500
Brandon: And it also includes the Galaxia Super Instrument, which lets you search across the entire library, stack instruments, apply macro controls, and basically play the whole thing like a single instrument that you can use in the studio, live, or drop it in your favorite DAWs, an AU or VST plugin.

00:35:14.500 –> 00:35:15.300
John Kennedy: Sounds amazing.

00:35:15.300 –> 00:35:17.480
John Kennedy: Tell us about the offer for Tape Notes listeners.

00:35:17.480 –> 00:35:34.200
Brandon: So for Tape Notes listeners, we have the Roland Cloud Ultimate free trial for 30 days, which gives you everything Roland Cloud has to offer, and also 10% off the price of a yearly Ultimate membership with the code tapenotesrc-1024, and there are only 100 of these available, so don’t miss out.

00:35:34.200 –> 00:35:34.860
John Kennedy: Thanks, Brandon.

00:35:34.860 –> 00:35:48.000
John Kennedy: To try out Roland Cloud Ultimate for yourself and start using some of their iconic instruments, head to rolandcloud.com and use the code tapenotesrc-1024 for 10% off while supplies last.

00:35:48.000 –> 00:35:51.220
Mason Stoops: 75% of all the sounds in every song I make will be recorded on my phone.

00:35:51.220 –> 00:35:53.700
Lizzy McAlpine: I make voice memos throughout the whole writing process.

00:35:53.700 –> 00:35:55.360
Lizzy McAlpine: Trumpet impression on a voice note.

00:35:55.780 –> 00:35:57.360
John Kennedy: I call it on my phone.

00:35:57.360 –> 00:36:00.200
John Kennedy: The phone really is like key.

00:36:00.200 –> 00:36:06.600
John Kennedy: The voices of past Tape Notes guests who rely on voice memos to capture ideas, rehearsals and on-the-go recordings.

00:36:06.600 –> 00:36:13.040
John Kennedy: This episode is being supported by Tape It, the ultimate iPhone voice note app designed specifically for musicians.

00:36:13.040 –> 00:36:24.120
John Kennedy: Tape It offers you features you won’t find in voice memos, including automatic instrument detection, easy marker tools, long form scrolling and collaborative mixtapes to share sounds with bandmates and co-writers.

00:36:24.500 –> 00:36:30.760
John Kennedy: Among the many other features, you can record directly from your lock screen and attach text or photo notes to your recordings.

00:36:30.760 –> 00:36:32.720
John Kennedy: Worried about losing old voice memos?

00:36:32.720 –> 00:36:37.160
John Kennedy: Tape It allows easy importing, cloud syncing and direct door transfers.

00:36:37.160 –> 00:36:43.740
John Kennedy: So click the link in a recent episode of Show Notes or head to tape.it forward slash tape notes to download Tape It for free.

00:36:43.740 –> 00:36:49.220
John Kennedy: And for even more, check out Tape It Pro and use promo code Tape Notes for 20% off.

00:36:49.220 –> 00:36:51.660
John Kennedy: That’s tape.it forward slash Tape Notes.

00:36:51.660 –> 00:36:52.700
John Kennedy: Now on with the show.

00:36:57.860 –> 00:37:04.860
John Kennedy: The next one we’re going to look at from Older is Pushing It Down and Praying by Lizzy McAlpine and Lizzy is going to play us a Blast of the Master.

00:37:04.880 –> 00:37:05.240
John Kennedy: Oh, yeah.

00:38:37.055 –> 00:38:42.575
John Kennedy: Lizzy McAlpine with Pushing It Down and Praying from the new deluxe version of Older.

00:38:42.575 –> 00:38:44.375
John Kennedy: So this is Older and Wiser.

00:38:44.375 –> 00:38:48.795
John Kennedy: So this is part of Wiser, or and Wiser, if we want to be specific.

00:38:50.075 –> 00:38:54.255
John Kennedy: You did release this as a single, but that’s one of the burning questions.

00:38:54.595 –> 00:39:00.535
John Kennedy: The Wiser section, five more amazing tracks, could they not have been part of the original 14, or would that just be too big?

00:39:00.535 –> 00:39:02.355
Lizzy McAlpine: A lot of them were not written yet.

00:39:02.355 –> 00:39:02.835
John Kennedy: Right.

00:39:02.835 –> 00:39:08.055
Lizzy McAlpine: And also I knew that I wanted to do a deluxe kind of pretty early on.

00:39:08.055 –> 00:39:08.395
John Kennedy: Yeah.

00:39:08.395 –> 00:39:15.635
Lizzy McAlpine: Because I just had so many songs that I wrote for this album that were good, and that just didn’t make it into the final album for one reason or another.

00:39:15.635 –> 00:39:37.515
Lizzy McAlpine: So I knew that I wanted to add on eventually, and I wanted it to be its own thing, I think, because these songs, I mean, a couple of them weren’t even written when we were making the album, but they just feel like the final chapter of what I wanted to say about this relationship that I was writing about, the themes and everything, and it really felt like the closing thoughts that I had.

00:39:37.515 –> 00:39:40.335
Lizzy McAlpine: So I knew that I wanted it to be a different thing.

00:39:40.335 –> 00:39:40.695
John Kennedy: Yeah.

00:39:40.695 –> 00:39:41.435
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

00:39:41.435 –> 00:39:44.075
John Kennedy: How did Pushing It Down and Praying Stop?

00:39:44.075 –> 00:39:56.315
Lizzy McAlpine: I wrote this song on an off week, a couple of weeks when we were in between touring, I think I wrote it in like May, and I made a voice memo as I always do for my songs.

00:39:56.315 –> 00:40:09.535
Lizzy McAlpine: And then at the end of our East Coast leg of tour in like June, we went back to New York afterwards and had like four days in Electric Lady Studios, which was amazing.

00:40:09.535 –> 00:40:11.775
Lizzy McAlpine: I’ve never been there and it was so cool.

00:40:11.775 –> 00:40:14.915
Lizzy McAlpine: And yeah, we had four days to record four songs.

00:40:14.915 –> 00:40:16.735
Lizzy McAlpine: It was very fun and a little bit stressful.

00:40:18.135 –> 00:40:23.115
Lizzy McAlpine: But when we got to this song, I played everyone the voice memo and I was under the impression.

00:40:23.115 –> 00:40:24.855
Lizzy McAlpine: I was like, okay, we’re going to like redo it.

00:40:24.855 –> 00:40:27.675
Lizzy McAlpine: Like I’m going to go in there and track guitar and vocal together.

00:40:27.695 –> 00:40:29.575
Lizzy McAlpine: And I think it was your idea.

00:40:29.575 –> 00:40:36.055
Lizzy McAlpine: You were like, Mason was like, we should just use the voice memo and just like track band on top of it.

00:40:36.055 –> 00:40:36.315
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:40:36.315 –> 00:40:39.235
Mason Stoops: I mean, it was so good.

00:40:39.235 –> 00:40:40.255
John Kennedy: Let’s hear that voice memo.

00:41:12.235 –> 00:41:13.375
John Kennedy: It sounds brilliant, though.

00:41:13.375 –> 00:41:14.755
Lizzy McAlpine: I know, it sounds really great.

00:41:14.755 –> 00:41:16.975
Mason Stoops: The iPhone microphone is so…

00:41:16.995 –> 00:41:17.755
Taylor Mackall: iPhone and Lizzie.

00:41:17.755 –> 00:41:18.075
Mason Stoops: So good.

00:41:18.075 –> 00:41:18.335
John Kennedy: I know.

00:41:18.335 –> 00:41:19.015
Taylor Mackall: That’s all you need.

00:41:22.855 –> 00:41:23.915
Mason Stoops: Yeah, here’s where the band normally…

00:41:28.863 –> 00:41:30.043
Lizzy McAlpine: And we just tracked over top of this.

00:41:30.043 –> 00:41:33.883
Lizzy McAlpine: So the voicemail was running through the whole song, and then we just added stuff on top.

00:41:33.883 –> 00:41:38.643
Lizzy McAlpine: And honestly, so glad that I got that good of a take.

00:41:38.643 –> 00:41:39.463
Mason Stoops: Like if you had cough.

00:41:39.463 –> 00:41:40.563
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, right, it’s over.

00:41:40.563 –> 00:41:43.263
Lizzy McAlpine: If anything had gone wrong, we couldn’t have used it.

00:41:43.263 –> 00:41:45.403
John Kennedy: Sorry, in terms of positioning, where are you placing that?

00:41:45.403 –> 00:41:47.403
Mason Stoops: Yeah, I actually was gonna ask that too.

00:41:47.403 –> 00:41:48.263
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t even remember.

00:41:48.263 –> 00:41:53.543
Lizzy McAlpine: I think that one, it was on my bed, just right here, and then I was just playing into it.

00:41:54.363 –> 00:41:56.163
John Kennedy: So a few feet away from you.

00:41:56.163 –> 00:42:01.923
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, not like right here, like maybe a foot away from me.

00:42:01.923 –> 00:42:04.503
John Kennedy: I’m just impressed how clear the voice sounds.

00:42:04.503 –> 00:42:06.823
Lizzy McAlpine: Some of the voice modes that I get are really great quality.

00:42:06.823 –> 00:42:08.383
Lizzy McAlpine: I’m really impressed.

00:42:08.943 –> 00:42:40.363
Mason Stoops: It was a combination of this sounds really cool, and also just spiritually, with what Lizzy was singing about and the subject matter of that song, it’s so vulnerable and it’s so raw, and it’s really honest in a way that I think you just feel lyrically you’re there with her, and there was something really, it felt appropriate to given the subject matter, how much closer could you get to Lizzy than you’re in the room with her, just the moment after she wrote it really.

00:42:40.363 –> 00:42:42.303
Mason Stoops: That vocal performance is really raw too.

00:42:42.763 –> 00:42:44.623
Mason Stoops: You had just written it.

00:42:44.623 –> 00:42:51.343
Mason Stoops: What we’re hearing is it’s the closest we can get to that actual moment that you were feeling those things when you wrote those words.

00:42:52.323 –> 00:43:05.723
Mason Stoops: And I love any opportunity to use something imperfect, especially when we were able to contrast it with all the sounds we’re able to get at Electric Lady, which is obviously a phenomenal recording studio.

00:43:05.723 –> 00:43:10.963
Mason Stoops: So that juxtaposition of we have such beautiful recordings of the instruments in the band.

00:43:10.963 –> 00:43:18.463
Mason Stoops: But what you’re hearing from Lizzy is this really real performance, you know, from the bedroom like that she’s singing about.

00:43:18.643 –> 00:43:21.643
Mason Stoops: And that’s crazy.

00:43:21.643 –> 00:43:22.383
Mason Stoops: It is crazy.

00:43:22.763 –> 00:43:30.163
Mason Stoops: And then it’s also like the fact that you were able to do that, like that what we’re hearing is that’s not like someone directing you or guiding you.

00:43:30.163 –> 00:43:31.643
Mason Stoops: We didn’t comp a vocal together.

00:43:31.643 –> 00:43:36.883
Mason Stoops: That’s really you at your most, you know, like you were truly alone.

00:43:36.883 –> 00:43:37.603
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:43:37.603 –> 00:43:49.623
Mason Stoops: How often do you really get to hear that from an artist versus like, OK, let’s put her with the, you know, a U67 and like a perfect room and get the best vocal pass and the best vocal performance.

00:43:49.623 –> 00:43:56.623
Mason Stoops: We got a rare opportunity to kind of forget all of that stuff and really just hear a real performance.

00:43:58.083 –> 00:44:04.403
Mason Stoops: The other striking and amazing thing about that voice memo too is her guitar playing is so rock solid.

00:44:04.403 –> 00:44:08.743
Mason Stoops: We all on stage every night, we really lock into Lizzy’s rhythm playing.

00:44:08.743 –> 00:44:12.883
Lizzy McAlpine: There’s one part where I kind of like speed up the tempo just a little bit.

00:44:12.883 –> 00:44:16.743
Lizzy McAlpine: And so when everyone was playing along to it, they were like, oh, OK, we got to follow.

00:44:16.783 –> 00:44:17.563
Lizzy McAlpine: But it was just one part.

00:44:17.843 –> 00:44:23.063
Mason Stoops: Yeah, we should play that because that’s the only moment that the whole song that Lizzy speeds up.

00:44:23.063 –> 00:44:25.143
Mason Stoops: But it actually kind of thematically works too.

00:44:25.143 –> 00:44:26.443
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s the end of the second chorus.

00:44:26.443 –> 00:44:28.363
Mason Stoops: And do you want me to play it?

00:44:28.443 –> 00:44:28.663
John Kennedy: Yeah.

00:44:31.543 –> 00:44:32.903
Mason Stoops: So we’re chilling here.

00:44:32.903 –> 00:44:33.383
Lizzy McAlpine: Right here.

00:44:33.383 –> 00:44:33.763
Mason Stoops: And then…

00:44:39.803 –> 00:44:41.943
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s so subtle.

00:44:41.943 –> 00:44:42.743
Mason Stoops: Or is it later?

00:44:42.743 –> 00:44:43.423
Lizzy McAlpine: No, I thought it was there.

00:44:45.263 –> 00:44:45.943
Mason Stoops: It might be there.

00:44:46.143 –> 00:44:47.463
Lizzy McAlpine: We can’t even tell anymore.

00:44:47.543 –> 00:44:50.423
Lizzy McAlpine: When we were recording, it was like very obvious.

00:44:50.423 –> 00:44:50.663
Mason Stoops: Right.

00:44:50.663 –> 00:44:51.863
John Kennedy: So you made this decision.

00:44:51.863 –> 00:44:53.363
John Kennedy: We’re going to use the voice memo.

00:44:53.363 –> 00:44:54.323
John Kennedy: It’s got the vocal.

00:44:54.323 –> 00:44:55.723
John Kennedy: It’s got Lizzy’s guitar part.

00:44:55.723 –> 00:44:57.663
John Kennedy: And we’re going to play to that.

00:44:57.663 –> 00:44:58.483
Taylor Mackall: Yeah.

00:44:58.483 –> 00:45:01.983
Mason Stoops: It was kind of like one of those scenes in the movie.

00:45:01.983 –> 00:45:03.383
Mason Stoops: Everyone kind of like looks at each other.

00:45:03.383 –> 00:45:05.063
Mason Stoops: And like before, like would they make the move?

00:45:05.063 –> 00:45:07.303
Mason Stoops: And it’s like, we’re doing this, right?

00:45:07.303 –> 00:45:09.243
Taylor Mackall: All right.

00:45:09.243 –> 00:45:15.283
Mason Stoops: So we sent Libro and Remy Morritt, our drummer and bass player into the live room first.

00:45:15.383 –> 00:45:18.003
Mason Stoops: We’re in the big room downstairs at Electric Lady.

00:45:18.003 –> 00:45:19.743
Mason Stoops: So they did probably three or four takes.

00:45:19.743 –> 00:45:21.583
Mason Stoops: I wonder if we have that here.

00:45:21.583 –> 00:45:23.763
Mason Stoops: But that was a moment they had to really hone in on.

00:45:23.763 –> 00:45:31.243
Mason Stoops: And that was otherwise we could have gotten it in one pass, but then really honing in on Lizzy’s time in that one section.

00:45:31.243 –> 00:45:37.463
Mason Stoops: And we even negotiated, we thought about, and, you know, because, you know, it’s 2024, certainly could stretch it.

00:45:37.463 –> 00:45:46.703
Mason Stoops: You could, there’s ways to to fix time, but we really stuck with the idea of like, no, there’s something here, and the imperfection is the point.

00:45:46.703 –> 00:45:48.463
Lizzy McAlpine: And you can’t even really tell anymore.

00:45:48.463 –> 00:45:51.963
Lizzy McAlpine: We can only really tell when we were tracking because we were so locked in.

00:45:51.963 –> 00:45:58.083
Mason Stoops: But we really, we debated, like, between takes, like, should we, are we doing this?

00:45:58.083 –> 00:46:02.543
Mason Stoops: Like, we’re doing, like, just try one more, and we finally got it, and it just felt so good.

00:46:02.543 –> 00:46:04.463
Lizzy McAlpine: And then we played the drums and the bass take.

00:46:04.463 –> 00:46:04.683
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:46:04.683 –> 00:46:05.623
Lizzy McAlpine: Or together, right?

00:46:05.623 –> 00:46:06.383
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:46:06.383 –> 00:46:08.203
Lizzy McAlpine: Do you want me to play the vocal with it?

00:46:08.203 –> 00:46:08.423
Mason Stoops: Sure.

00:46:17.043 –> 00:46:20.883
Lizzy McAlpine: This is my extra layered vocals on top for some more.

00:46:56.823 –> 00:46:57.423
Lizzy McAlpine: It was right there.

00:46:57.423 –> 00:46:58.923
Mason Stoops: That’s the moment that it speeds up.

00:47:00.923 –> 00:47:02.783
John Kennedy: I love that you just stuck with that.

00:47:02.783 –> 00:47:03.143
Mason Stoops: I mean.

00:47:03.983 –> 00:47:13.843
Lizzy McAlpine: Because you can’t really tell in the grand scheme of things, but it feels like also at the place where it is, it’s right before that bridge, I feel like it just like gives it a little lift into the bridge.

00:47:13.843 –> 00:47:26.643
Mason Stoops: Yeah, I mean, there’s a lot of times that like, you know, it makes sense to slow a chorus down on a song, like a couple BPM or bring of, you know, we can always play with time and we can usually do it intentionally and that’s really cool.

00:47:26.643 –> 00:47:37.803
Mason Stoops: But I love the idea that if we accept that Lizzy has great time, which she does, then that little push there was like, that was like an emotional response or something.

00:47:37.803 –> 00:47:40.583
Mason Stoops: That was you like, that was something you felt.

00:47:40.583 –> 00:47:51.623
Mason Stoops: And so just leaning into as much as we could, that state and place Lizzy was in, in that voice memo when she wrote that, I think really inspired and set us up for the rest of the song.

00:47:51.623 –> 00:47:56.923
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, also people have been like, oh, like what type of thing did you use on the vocals?

00:47:56.923 –> 00:47:58.243
Lizzy McAlpine: Like what is that?

00:47:58.243 –> 00:47:59.223
Lizzy McAlpine: What kind of mic is that?

00:47:59.223 –> 00:48:00.043
Lizzy McAlpine: Like what effects?

00:48:00.483 –> 00:48:03.703
Lizzy McAlpine: We’re like, it’s a voice memo, iPhone.

00:48:05.323 –> 00:48:08.483
John Kennedy: But in the room that you were recording that, so was this a hotel room or a?

00:48:08.483 –> 00:48:09.963
Lizzy McAlpine: No, it was just my room at home.

00:48:09.963 –> 00:48:13.943
John Kennedy: Right, so your room at home, were you singing in a hushed way or were you?

00:48:14.523 –> 00:48:17.943
Lizzy McAlpine: I mean, I don’t have neighbors that can hear me that, so I don’t really care.

00:48:17.943 –> 00:48:20.323
John Kennedy: So it wasn’t that you needed to be conscious of anything like that?

00:48:20.703 –> 00:48:22.403
John Kennedy: Because it has such an intimacy to it.

00:48:22.803 –> 00:48:25.683
Lizzy McAlpine: I think that was just like the vibe of the song.

00:48:25.683 –> 00:48:27.243
Mason Stoops: Yeah, just how you were feeling.

00:48:27.243 –> 00:48:28.443
Mason Stoops: I love the idea too.

00:48:28.443 –> 00:48:31.523
Mason Stoops: No one could have told you at that moment, like you just recorded the song.

00:48:31.523 –> 00:48:32.303
Lizzy McAlpine: Oh my God, that was it.

00:48:32.303 –> 00:48:34.983
Mason Stoops: That was so crazy, you know?

00:48:34.983 –> 00:48:35.503
John Kennedy: Yeah.

00:48:35.503 –> 00:48:38.163
John Kennedy: Can we hear more of the band parts as they come in?

00:48:38.163 –> 00:48:38.343
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:48:39.363 –> 00:48:47.343
Taylor Mackall: I would love to check out the lead guitar because I was there at Electric Lady when Mason said, okay, I’ll do a take now.

00:48:47.343 –> 00:48:56.683
Taylor Mackall: I hear some guitar and our mans would never talk about it because he’s that humble, but he goes in and just destroys it in one take.

00:48:56.723 –> 00:49:01.303
Taylor Mackall: It’s some of my favorite Mason playing of the last decade.

00:49:01.543 –> 00:49:02.743
Lizzy McAlpine: In the bridge?

00:49:03.763 –> 00:49:06.803
Taylor Mackall: It’s like the natural hits on two, and none of it’s intellectual.

00:49:06.803 –> 00:49:07.983
Taylor Mackall: It’s just playing from the heart.

00:49:07.983 –> 00:49:16.063
Taylor Mackall: But I think it’s so in keeping with Lizzy doing one take and Mason doing one take and just being raw and in the moment and just giving everything they had.

00:49:16.063 –> 00:49:17.583
Taylor Mackall: So we have to check that out.

00:49:17.583 –> 00:49:20.063
Lizzy McAlpine: Do you want me to play it with the drums and vocal and stuff?

00:49:20.063 –> 00:49:21.643
Mason Stoops: Yeah, might as well.

00:49:21.643 –> 00:49:22.743
Mason Stoops: It’s a stereo.

00:49:22.743 –> 00:49:27.123
Mason Stoops: I record it with two amps in stereo, which I pretty much always do.

00:49:27.123 –> 00:49:32.203
Mason Stoops: It was a little Univox U45B, which is like a Japanese bass amp that I love.

00:49:32.443 –> 00:49:36.363
Mason Stoops: And we did the record with in a Benson Nathan Jr.

00:49:36.363 –> 00:49:40.543
Mason Stoops: So two little tube amps with a stereo slap that’s happening.

00:49:40.543 –> 00:49:43.283
Mason Stoops: So there’s a slight delay on one side.

00:49:43.283 –> 00:49:48.403
Mason Stoops: So the guitar has this kind of pulling as Lizzy’s like pushing the band and it just gives a-

00:49:48.403 –> 00:49:49.543
Lizzy McAlpine: Pushing it down?

00:49:49.543 –> 00:49:51.463
Mason Stoops: I don’t even think about that.

00:50:31.950 –> 00:50:33.310
Taylor Mackall: This one, this one.

00:50:36.190 –> 00:50:37.430
Taylor Mackall: Come on, man.

00:50:37.430 –> 00:50:40.430
Mason Stoops: That’s not the amps, man.

00:50:40.430 –> 00:50:41.550
John Kennedy: Can we solo that?

00:50:41.550 –> 00:50:43.070
Mason Stoops: Yeah, I mean…

00:50:43.070 –> 00:50:46.490
Taylor Mackall: Let’s go.

00:50:46.490 –> 00:50:51.210
Lizzy McAlpine: The bleed from the headphones.

00:50:51.210 –> 00:50:52.830
Taylor Mackall: It’s a million dollar chord right there.

00:50:52.830 –> 00:50:54.430
Lizzy McAlpine: The bridge part is so good.

00:51:25.890 –> 00:51:27.250
Lizzy McAlpine: I was like, that is it.

00:51:27.250 –> 00:51:28.150
Lizzy McAlpine: We gotta keep that.

00:51:28.150 –> 00:51:33.430
Taylor Mackall: This last chord too is beautiful.

00:51:33.430 –> 00:51:34.490
Taylor Mackall: Storytelling chord.

00:51:34.490 –> 00:51:35.910
Taylor Mackall: It’s beautiful.

00:51:35.910 –> 00:51:37.570
Mason Stoops: And I had a little echo plex next to me.

00:51:38.697 –> 00:51:40.497
Mason Stoops: I always have an old EP2.

00:51:40.497 –> 00:51:44.217
Mason Stoops: I love EP2s of all the echo plexes.

00:51:44.217 –> 00:51:46.297
Mason Stoops: I usually have one kind of station nearby.

00:51:46.297 –> 00:51:51.297
Mason Stoops: So I just cranked up the repeats at the end there.

00:51:51.297 –> 00:51:54.677
Lizzy McAlpine: I mean, yeah, I’ve heard that bridge and I was like, we gotta keep that.

00:51:54.677 –> 00:51:55.837
Lizzy McAlpine: We gotta keep all this.

00:51:55.837 –> 00:51:56.677
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s so good.

00:51:56.677 –> 00:51:57.837
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, kept everything.

00:51:58.317 –> 00:52:00.077
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, and then we just doubled that melody.

00:52:00.077 –> 00:52:05.337
John Kennedy: You mentioned something about the bridge earlier on, that the bridge wasn’t written in that first session.

00:52:05.517 –> 00:52:14.837
Lizzy McAlpine: I had, I made one voice because usually I’ll write a song and if I’m like missing a section or whatever, I’ll just write it and then I’ll be like, okay, I’ll come back to it maybe tomorrow.

00:52:14.837 –> 00:52:17.437
Lizzy McAlpine: And then like 30 minutes later, I have the next section written.

00:52:17.437 –> 00:52:19.877
Lizzy McAlpine: Like when the song is gonna come, it’s gonna come.

00:52:19.877 –> 00:52:23.937
Lizzy McAlpine: So I initially wrote this song and it did not have the bridge words.

00:52:23.937 –> 00:52:27.357
Lizzy McAlpine: It just had like some weird like, oh, like.

00:52:39.173 –> 00:52:42.233
Lizzy McAlpine: Like, I had no words yet.

00:52:42.233 –> 00:52:44.473
Mason Stoops: Do you remember what guitar you were using?

00:52:45.753 –> 00:52:46.693
Mason Stoops: Is it the Vega?

00:52:46.693 –> 00:52:47.593
Mason Stoops: Doesn’t sound like the Vega.

00:52:47.593 –> 00:52:50.693
Lizzy McAlpine: No, I think it was just mine that I had at home.

00:52:50.693 –> 00:52:52.653
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t know what that is.

00:52:52.653 –> 00:52:53.413
Mason Stoops: Mystery guitar.

00:52:53.413 –> 00:52:54.573
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, mystery guitar.

00:52:54.573 –> 00:52:56.213
Lizzy McAlpine: It was just the one that was around.

00:52:56.213 –> 00:53:02.353
Lizzy McAlpine: Because I don’t really have that many guitars that I actually like to play, and I have one at home.

00:53:02.353 –> 00:53:05.093
Lizzy McAlpine: So I was like, I need to write this song.

00:53:05.093 –> 00:53:07.153
Lizzy McAlpine: When a song is gonna come out, it needs to come out.

00:53:07.573 –> 00:53:13.933
Lizzy McAlpine: One time when I was in New York, I was staying at a hotel, and I was like, I know there’s a song that needs to come out of me right now.

00:53:13.933 –> 00:53:14.573
Lizzy McAlpine: I need a guitar.

00:53:14.573 –> 00:53:19.273
Lizzy McAlpine: So I made my manager, Molly, rent me a guitar for a couple of days, and then I wrote the song.

00:53:19.433 –> 00:53:21.753
Lizzy McAlpine: When it comes out, it has to come out somehow.

00:53:21.753 –> 00:53:23.533
Lizzy McAlpine: So I used the only guitar I had.

00:53:23.533 –> 00:53:24.553
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t know.

00:53:24.553 –> 00:53:25.353
Mason Stoops: That’s sick.

00:53:25.353 –> 00:53:26.033
John Kennedy: Yeah.

00:53:26.033 –> 00:53:27.293
John Kennedy: So that bridge turned into?

00:53:27.673 –> 00:53:28.273
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

00:53:28.273 –> 00:53:29.293
Mason Stoops: The bridge on the song.

00:53:29.293 –> 00:53:29.633
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:54:02.413 –> 00:54:03.073
Lizzy McAlpine: I love it.

00:54:03.073 –> 00:54:05.993
Mason Stoops: We should talk about Taylor’s vibe or foam, too.

00:54:05.993 –> 00:54:09.273
Lizzy McAlpine: There are no actual keys on this song.

00:54:09.273 –> 00:54:10.993
Lizzy McAlpine: There’s just vibes.

00:54:10.993 –> 00:54:14.113
Taylor Mackall: Just vibes, just the way I like it, being from Southern California.

00:54:15.513 –> 00:54:20.893
Taylor Mackall: But yeah, I mean, as much as I wanted to play piano on it, I simply didn’t hear piano on it, you know?

00:54:20.893 –> 00:54:24.933
Taylor Mackall: That felt like Forrestine Effected to put something on that I didn’t hear.

00:54:24.933 –> 00:54:27.133
Taylor Mackall: But I did hear vibraphone in my head.

00:54:27.133 –> 00:54:30.933
Taylor Mackall: And being an electric lady, there were vibes there.

00:54:30.933 –> 00:54:34.433
Taylor Mackall: Hopefully the same ones that D’Angelo played on Voodoo, but I don’t know.

00:54:34.433 –> 00:54:35.533
Mason Stoops: We’re going to assume that they were.

00:54:36.433 –> 00:54:36.913
John Kennedy: Could well be.

00:54:37.193 –> 00:54:37.853
John Kennedy: Why not?

00:54:37.853 –> 00:54:39.173
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, they were Voodoo.

00:54:39.173 –> 00:54:43.033
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, the actual Voodoo vibraphone.

00:54:43.033 –> 00:54:43.833
Mason Stoops: Can we hear something?

00:54:43.833 –> 00:54:46.413
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, let me play it.

00:54:46.413 –> 00:54:47.733
Taylor Mackall: I love this pre-chorus.

00:54:47.733 –> 00:54:50.153
Taylor Mackall: I think it’s so beautiful, the melody and harmony.

00:54:50.153 –> 00:54:51.193
Taylor Mackall: So I just wanted to double it.

00:55:10.210 –> 00:55:28.410
Mason Stoops: Yeah, we mic’d it in stereo, and then when we went in to mix, Sarlo and I, Andrew Sarlo, who mixed both the full-length and the deluxe record, we worked really hard on those vibes to where I think we ended up putting a pretty heavy tremolo on one side and leaving the other side dry.

00:55:28.410 –> 00:55:31.250
Mason Stoops: As much like push and pull kind of on your ears.

00:55:31.430 –> 00:55:44.070
Mason Stoops: It’s like this whole song is about kind of implying tension, or we just wanted there to be something a little more visceral to them, because they’re so beautiful, but if there’s a way to make them kind of make you a little seasick and.

00:55:44.070 –> 00:55:44.750
Taylor Mackall: Nice.

00:55:44.750 –> 00:55:45.670
John Kennedy: Are we able to hear them again?

00:55:45.670 –> 00:55:45.990
John Kennedy: Let’s do it.

00:55:45.990 –> 00:55:50.830
John Kennedy: Yeah.

00:55:50.830 –> 00:55:51.530
Mason Stoops: But it is cool.

00:55:51.530 –> 00:56:04.070
Mason Stoops: It’s because obviously you have the vibrato and the tremolo happening naturally on the vibraphone from the motor, but then kind of taking that a step further with the tremolo was something that really helped kind of give it space.

00:56:04.970 –> 00:56:05.430
John Kennedy: Yeah.

00:56:05.430 –> 00:56:08.910
Mason Stoops: And then the last thing which like I feel like super important to talk about is our friends.

00:56:08.910 –> 00:56:16.670
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, we got our friends Tiny Habits to come and sing some background vocals on this song and also Spring into Summer, which is another deluxe song.

00:56:16.670 –> 00:56:18.430
Lizzy McAlpine: And I just am obsessed with them.

00:56:18.430 –> 00:56:22.650
Lizzy McAlpine: I love them so much and they’re so good at coming up with the cool harmonies.

00:56:22.650 –> 00:56:24.890
Mason Stoops: Yeah, we just let them kind of do their thing.

00:56:24.890 –> 00:56:25.650
Mason Stoops: Arrange it.

00:56:25.650 –> 00:56:32.070
Mason Stoops: We played them the song and they kind of like, okay, they went into the little green room on the side at Electric Lady and came back out with this arrangement.

00:56:32.470 –> 00:56:35.190
Lizzy McAlpine: And then I sang with them on the chorus because I love to sing with them.

00:56:35.470 –> 00:56:38.150
Lizzy McAlpine: We’ve sung together a couple of times now and-

00:56:38.370 –> 00:56:39.610
John Kennedy: Who are Tiny Habits, Rosh?

00:56:39.610 –> 00:56:41.090
Lizzy McAlpine: Tiny Habits is a group.

00:56:41.090 –> 00:56:43.530
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s made up of Sinya, Judah and Maya.

00:56:43.530 –> 00:56:47.110
Lizzy McAlpine: And they’re all, I think they all at one point went to Berkeley.

00:56:47.110 –> 00:56:48.510
Lizzy McAlpine: That’s how I found them.

00:56:48.510 –> 00:56:52.630
Lizzy McAlpine: And we just became friends and have like sung together.

00:56:52.630 –> 00:56:56.170
Lizzy McAlpine: I, yeah, I’m just like obsessed with them.

00:56:56.170 –> 00:56:59.330
Lizzy McAlpine: And they just do like really crazy harmonies.

00:56:59.330 –> 00:56:59.450
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

00:56:59.450 –> 00:57:00.210
Lizzy McAlpine: And it’s really cool.

00:57:00.470 –> 00:57:03.630
Mason Stoops: They’re three of like the greatest vocalists.

00:57:03.630 –> 00:57:11.210
Mason Stoops: But what makes it so special is they’re able to kind of elicit like other really complex emotions with the things they come up with.

00:57:11.210 –> 00:57:14.410
Mason Stoops: And initially we were only going to have them on spring into summer.

00:57:14.410 –> 00:57:15.730
Mason Stoops: That was the idea.

00:57:15.730 –> 00:57:19.910
Mason Stoops: And then it was Ryan Richter, our Lapsdale player, who I think was like, he went up to you.

00:57:19.910 –> 00:57:24.410
Lizzy McAlpine: He texted me and he was like, you should have them rip on Pushing It Down and Praying.

00:57:24.410 –> 00:57:25.810
Lizzy McAlpine: I think that was the wording.

00:57:25.810 –> 00:57:27.330
Lizzy McAlpine: And I was like, oh, sure.

00:57:27.330 –> 00:57:27.930
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

00:57:27.930 –> 00:57:28.430
Mason Stoops: And so we did.

00:57:28.710 –> 00:57:29.450
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

00:57:29.450 –> 00:57:29.950
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

00:57:30.350 –> 00:57:31.290
John Kennedy: I’m we gonna hear it.

00:57:31.290 –> 00:57:31.970
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

00:57:31.970 –> 00:57:33.870
Lizzy McAlpine: Should I play it with my vocal or just solo?

00:57:33.870 –> 00:57:36.090
Mason Stoops: Let’s solo them for a second and maybe you can bring your vocal in.

00:58:04.187 –> 00:58:07.327
Lizzy McAlpine: Let me come in on the chorus or a second verse.

00:58:07.327 –> 00:58:09.407
John Kennedy: How did you record Tiny Habits?

00:58:09.407 –> 00:58:10.767
Lizzy McAlpine: They just all stood around one mic.

00:58:10.767 –> 00:58:11.527
Mason Stoops: Yeah, right.

00:58:11.527 –> 00:58:15.747
Mason Stoops: Yeah, because just like everything else, we’re like, okay, what’s the normal way to do this?

00:58:15.747 –> 00:58:16.687
Mason Stoops: And let’s do the opposite.

00:58:16.687 –> 00:58:17.667
Lizzy McAlpine: Let’s do the opposite, yeah.

00:58:17.667 –> 00:58:21.067
Mason Stoops: So we put them all around either 67 or 87.

00:58:21.347 –> 00:58:23.227
Mason Stoops: I gotta go back and look.

00:58:23.227 –> 00:58:33.587
Lizzy McAlpine: And we had to kind of like stagger them, like away from the microphone in a way that, so each of their voices were like the same volume because some of them were louder than others, some of them are quieter.

00:58:33.587 –> 00:58:36.387
Lizzy McAlpine: So we had to like move them, like take a step back, take a step forward.

00:58:36.387 –> 00:58:37.987
Lizzy McAlpine: Like it was interesting.

00:58:37.987 –> 00:58:41.907
Mason Stoops: Sinya and Maya are like, you know, maybe four or five feet tall.

00:58:41.907 –> 00:58:43.867
Mason Stoops: And Judah is like all the way up there.

00:58:43.867 –> 00:58:46.147
Mason Stoops: He’s like, he’s gotta be 65 or something.

00:58:46.147 –> 00:58:47.967
Lizzy McAlpine: Probably something like that.

00:58:47.967 –> 00:58:53.207
Mason Stoops: So it’s, yeah, we needed, there was a ratio that needed to be found.

00:58:53.207 –> 00:58:56.267
Lizzy McAlpine: I wanna play them on the second chorus because it’s my favorite thing that they did.

00:58:56.967 –> 00:59:00.687
Lizzy McAlpine: Also, I sang with them on this chorus and it was very fun.

00:59:36.147 –> 00:59:36.887
Lizzy McAlpine: So good.

00:59:36.887 –> 00:59:37.367
Mason Stoops: So cool.

00:59:37.367 –> 00:59:39.007
Lizzy McAlpine: And the bridge, we just had them do like some…

00:59:41.947 –> 00:59:42.507
Lizzy McAlpine: I’m in there too.

00:59:52.027 –> 00:59:53.207
Lizzy McAlpine: We just kind of lost around.

00:59:53.207 –> 00:59:54.607
Mason Stoops: Pretty much improvised.

00:59:54.607 –> 00:59:55.447
Mason Stoops: Yeah, just like-

00:59:55.447 –> 00:59:56.867
Lizzy McAlpine: No plan.

00:59:56.867 –> 01:00:00.787
Mason Stoops: Kind of forced them like, all right, we’re gonna push the chord, just do something.

01:00:02.127 –> 01:00:03.447
Taylor Mackall: So beautiful.

01:00:05.867 –> 01:00:06.987
Taylor Mackall: It’s angelic.

01:00:08.547 –> 01:00:10.347
Lizzy McAlpine: Wow, so pretty.

01:00:10.347 –> 01:00:11.787
John Kennedy: Yeah, sounds fantastic.

01:00:11.787 –> 01:00:17.547
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, and it really added to the weight of that bridge and also that second chorus.

01:00:17.547 –> 01:00:23.287
Lizzy McAlpine: I mean, I’m gonna play the second chorus with them and then because it’s just so good.

01:00:23.287 –> 01:00:24.127
Lizzy McAlpine: They really add a lot.

01:00:44.977 –> 01:00:45.397
Taylor Mackall: So good.

01:00:55.277 –> 01:00:56.837
Mason Stoops: That’s that speed up.

01:00:56.837 –> 01:00:59.357
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, you can really feel it.

01:00:59.357 –> 01:01:03.797
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, they’re just so good, and they really elevated the song to another level, I think.

01:01:03.797 –> 01:01:06.257
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, it’s cool to watch you arrange with them, too.

01:01:06.257 –> 01:01:07.837
Taylor Mackall: You were definitely in your bag.

01:01:07.837 –> 01:01:08.457
Taylor Mackall: So fun.

01:01:08.997 –> 01:01:09.657
Taylor Mackall: You were stoked.

01:01:09.757 –> 01:01:10.577
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

01:01:10.577 –> 01:01:13.357
Mason Stoops: Really, the only other element on this song is in that bridge.

01:01:13.357 –> 01:01:22.337
Mason Stoops: We added a couple of acoustic guitars, I think a 12-string and a regular acoustic, and just tried to double that implied part I did on the bridge.

01:01:32.578 –> 01:01:38.838
Mason Stoops: Just like, celebrating all my favorite Wiser songs, secretly.

01:01:38.838 –> 01:01:43.218
Taylor Mackall: I love like a part that comes from something that was improvised, you know?

01:01:43.218 –> 01:01:44.498
Taylor Mackall: But that’s the part.

01:01:44.878 –> 01:01:45.058
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:01:45.058 –> 01:01:46.418
Taylor Mackall: So just emphasizing that.

01:01:46.418 –> 01:01:46.618
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:01:53.216 –> 01:01:55.756
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, so good.

01:01:55.756 –> 01:01:56.096
John Kennedy: It’s great.

01:01:56.536 –> 01:02:11.836
John Kennedy: I love the way that you’re able to use the instruments and the instrumentation to articulate the meaning of the song as you do across the album, but particularly on this song, because those extra instrumental aspects seem to really help the meaning of the song.

01:02:11.836 –> 01:02:16.036
John Kennedy: And then with Tiny Habits, somehow that lends greater power.

01:02:16.036 –> 01:02:20.176
John Kennedy: It makes it feel as if we’re, this is two people in this situation.

01:02:21.036 –> 01:02:27.576
John Kennedy: And that uncertainty that you’re articulating in your words, you can sense that there’s another person there.

01:02:27.576 –> 01:02:31.616
John Kennedy: And these words are in your head, but it’s great.

01:02:31.676 –> 01:02:42.416
Mason Stoops: And then as soon as it gets its biggest and most emotional, it falls apart and it just evaporates back to Lizzy alone with her thoughts and her feelings.

01:02:42.416 –> 01:02:44.616
Mason Stoops: And that just felt really appropriate.

01:02:44.616 –> 01:02:52.176
Mason Stoops: I remember we had tried before we’d committed to the voice memo idea when we were working on the arrangement for the band and how we were going to do this.

01:02:52.176 –> 01:02:57.956
Mason Stoops: It just wasn’t, I think everyone is getting frustrated, searching for how we’re going to make this song work.

01:02:57.956 –> 01:03:03.656
Mason Stoops: And it turns out the answer was in the demo all along, which is cool.

01:03:03.656 –> 01:03:04.636
Lizzy McAlpine: Usually is.

01:03:04.636 –> 01:03:06.016
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:03:06.016 –> 01:03:08.416
John Kennedy: Maybe we should, to round off, we should hear that last part.

01:03:08.936 –> 01:03:10.076
Lizzy McAlpine: From the bridge.

01:04:30.031 –> 01:04:32.831
Lizzy McAlpine: At the end, you can hear me turning the voicemail off.

01:04:39.557 –> 01:04:40.777
Taylor Mackall: I don’t know that sound so well.

01:04:40.777 –> 01:04:42.317
Mason Stoops: Yeah, it is.

01:04:42.317 –> 01:04:44.457
John Kennedy: Fantastic, absolutely beautiful.

01:04:44.457 –> 01:04:46.237
John Kennedy: So that is Pushing It Down and Praying.

01:04:46.237 –> 01:04:50.857
John Kennedy: The next song we’re going to look at from Older and Wiser is Force of Nature.

01:04:50.857 –> 01:04:52.097
Mason Stoops: Heck yeah.

01:04:54.137 –> 01:04:59.277
John Kennedy: This episode is supported by Museversal, an amazing service for working with session musicians remotely.

01:04:59.277 –> 01:05:05.077
John Kennedy: If you use session musicians or would like to, but it’s been too expensive or hard to organise, this is for you.

01:05:05.077 –> 01:05:08.897
John Kennedy: And we have a special Black Friday offer for any Tape Notes listeners.

01:05:09.417 –> 01:05:14.157
John Kennedy: 33% off for the first three months and a free mixing session.

01:05:14.157 –> 01:05:15.737
John Kennedy: But more on that in a moment.

01:05:15.737 –> 01:05:19.157
John Kennedy: I’ve got David from Museversal here to tell us more about it.

01:05:19.157 –> 01:05:19.997
John Kennedy: Hi David.

01:05:19.997 –> 01:05:21.277
John Kennedy: Great to have you on.

01:05:21.277 –> 01:05:23.117
John Kennedy: What is Museversal?

01:05:23.117 –> 01:05:24.617
David: Hey, thanks for having me here, John.

01:05:24.617 –> 01:05:26.057
David: I really appreciate it.

01:05:26.057 –> 01:05:32.697
David: Museversal is a platform to book unlimited remote recording sessions with world-class session musicians.

01:05:32.697 –> 01:05:39.657
David: We’re all too familiar with just how cumbersome, expensive, time-consuming it can be to record great musicians on your music.

01:05:39.737 –> 01:05:45.017
David: Essentially, what we did was we went and hired world-class recording talent, drummers, cellists, guitarists, etc.

01:05:45.017 –> 01:05:45.797
David: You name it.

01:05:45.797 –> 01:05:49.117
David: Then we created a platform where you can book live remote sessions with them.

01:05:49.117 –> 01:05:54.317
David: It takes that complexity away and allows you to focus just on making great music with great people.

01:05:54.317 –> 01:05:58.657
John Kennedy: We’ve had lots of great feedback from Tape Notes listeners already using Museversal.

01:05:58.657 –> 01:06:01.377
John Kennedy: Can you tell us more about the musicians that they’ve been working with?

01:06:01.377 –> 01:06:02.357
David: Yeah, absolutely.

01:06:02.357 –> 01:06:06.277
David: We have a super selective hiring process to make sure we’re only hiring the best.

01:06:06.277 –> 01:06:14.177
David: And the result of that is that we have musicians who’ve worked for the likes of Elton John, The Killers, Jay-Z, multi-time Grammy winners, you name it.

01:06:14.177 –> 01:06:14.957
David: We’ve got it.

01:06:14.957 –> 01:06:16.837
David: We pay them a stable monthly income.

01:06:16.837 –> 01:06:22.177
David: And the benefit for you as a member is that you get a roster that you can depend on around the clock.

01:06:22.177 –> 01:06:23.257
John Kennedy: Very impressive.

01:06:23.257 –> 01:06:24.777
John Kennedy: How does it work?

01:06:24.777 –> 01:06:27.157
David: Yeah, so it’s designed to be extremely easy.

01:06:27.157 –> 01:06:31.377
David: All you need to do is pick a time, book a session and send your song in whatever stage it’s in.

01:06:31.777 –> 01:06:37.217
David: You can send sheet music, a chord chart, audio files, and then tell the musician what you’d like them to do.

01:06:37.257 –> 01:06:39.837
David: They can either play as is or improvise, right?

01:06:39.837 –> 01:06:44.477
David: And so then you’ll join the musician over live stream and they’ll start recording right off the bat.

01:06:44.477 –> 01:06:50.717
David: Because the session’s live, it’s like you’re literally sitting in the studio with them and you get to give that feedback in real time.

01:06:50.717 –> 01:06:53.837
David: And then you’ll get your session files to download right afterwards.

01:06:53.837 –> 01:06:56.897
John Kennedy: And David, can you remind us of the offer for Tape Notes listeners?

01:06:56.897 –> 01:07:01.297
David: Yeah, so for Black Friday, we have a 33 percent discount off your first three months.

01:07:01.377 –> 01:07:07.477
David: So it’ll cost you $133 a month or about 99 pounds for unlimited remote sessions.

01:07:07.477 –> 01:07:12.277
David: You’ll get a free full day mixing session with a Grammy winning engineer on your fourth month as well.

01:07:12.277 –> 01:07:17.237
David: And unlike everyone else, you’ll be able to skip our waitlist and start booking sessions right away.

01:07:17.237 –> 01:07:20.697
David: However, this offer does expire on Friday, December 6th.

01:07:20.697 –> 01:07:22.677
David: So you got to go check it out now.

01:07:22.677 –> 01:07:23.297
John Kennedy: Fantastic.

01:07:23.297 –> 01:07:24.337
John Kennedy: Thanks so much, David.

01:07:24.337 –> 01:07:28.857
John Kennedy: To get the special Black Friday offer, find the link in any of our recent episode show notes.

01:07:29.777 –> 01:07:33.777
John Kennedy: The next song we’re going to look at from Older and Wiser is Force of Nature.

01:07:33.777 –> 01:07:36.397
John Kennedy: So if you could play us the master, Lizzy, that would be great.

01:09:09.576 –> 01:09:16.896
John Kennedy: So that’s Force of Nature by Lizzy McAlpine, another selection from Disc 2, the deluxe version of Older and Wiser.

01:09:16.896 –> 01:09:18.556
John Kennedy: Tell us about Force of Nature.

01:09:18.556 –> 01:09:21.816
Lizzy McAlpine: Okay, this song, there are a lot of twists and turns with this song.

01:09:21.816 –> 01:09:31.456
Lizzy McAlpine: So basically, I wrote like the first verse, just the who am I if not your lover, Force of Nature, Big Fish on the Line, Who are you if all you want is time.

01:09:31.456 –> 01:09:32.396
Lizzy McAlpine: That’s all I wrote.

01:09:32.396 –> 01:09:36.256
Lizzy McAlpine: I wrote that in August of 2023.

01:09:36.256 –> 01:09:37.496
Mason Stoops: Long time ago.

01:09:37.496 –> 01:09:39.696
Lizzy McAlpine: And then it kind of just sat there.

01:09:39.696 –> 01:09:43.796
Lizzy McAlpine: And then when we were recording in October, November.

01:09:43.796 –> 01:09:44.456
Mason Stoops: Of last year.

01:09:44.456 –> 01:09:45.716
Lizzy McAlpine: Of 2023.

01:09:45.716 –> 01:09:47.616
Lizzy McAlpine: There was a song on the track list that I didn’t like.

01:09:47.616 –> 01:09:57.776
Lizzy McAlpine: We replaced it with Older, but before we were in our little writing session mode after hours of the recording process, the three of us had stayed and we were just trying to write a song.

01:09:58.496 –> 01:10:02.216
Lizzy McAlpine: And I brought this one in to them and we started writing it.

01:10:02.216 –> 01:10:06.956
Lizzy McAlpine: We wrote like a chorus, the whole chorus part of like, I know I had a hand in that part.

01:10:06.956 –> 01:10:08.616
Lizzy McAlpine: We wrote that whole thing.

01:10:08.616 –> 01:10:12.736
Lizzy McAlpine: And then we got to the end of that chorus and I was like, I don’t want to work on this anymore.

01:10:12.736 –> 01:10:13.856
Lizzy McAlpine: Like, I don’t like it.

01:10:13.856 –> 01:10:16.056
Mason Stoops: Yeah, you lost interest really fast.

01:10:16.056 –> 01:10:18.036
Lizzy McAlpine: I just like, I was like, it’s not right for right now.

01:10:18.036 –> 01:10:19.796
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s not the time to be doing this.

01:10:19.796 –> 01:10:20.516
Lizzy McAlpine: We got to move on.

01:10:20.516 –> 01:10:25.756
Lizzy McAlpine: So then I pivoted, I found the older voice memo, and then we wrote Older in like 20 minutes.

01:10:26.536 –> 01:10:28.416
Lizzy McAlpine: And that was the song that was supposed to happen that night.

01:10:28.416 –> 01:10:34.276
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t think Force of Nature wasn’t ready yet to be finished, but we had started it then.

01:10:34.276 –> 01:10:35.296
Lizzy McAlpine: And then it kind of sat.

01:10:35.296 –> 01:10:39.496
Lizzy McAlpine: And when we were starting to think about Deluxe more seriously, I was like, I know I want this to be on it.

01:10:39.496 –> 01:10:44.976
Lizzy McAlpine: And then I also had this other demo that I had made a while ago.

01:10:44.976 –> 01:10:49.516
Lizzy McAlpine: And it was the same like strumming guitar pattern.

01:10:49.516 –> 01:10:52.956
Lizzy McAlpine: We changed it to be in the same key as the Force of Nature song.

01:10:53.556 –> 01:10:58.356
Lizzy McAlpine: And I was like, I kind of like this, maybe we could combine the two songs.

01:10:58.356 –> 01:11:01.676
Lizzy McAlpine: And they were very lyrically different.

01:11:01.676 –> 01:11:06.696
Lizzy McAlpine: The Force of Nature that we started is like, I don’t know who I am now that I’m not in this relationship with you.

01:11:06.696 –> 01:11:10.376
Lizzy McAlpine: And then the demo is like, I literally don’t want to ever see your face ever again.

01:11:10.376 –> 01:11:13.016
Lizzy McAlpine: Like, leave me alone.

01:11:13.016 –> 01:11:18.156
Lizzy McAlpine: So combining them was interesting to try and like meld the two worlds.

01:11:18.156 –> 01:11:24.476
Lizzy McAlpine: But yeah, I can play this demo because this demo really like influenced our recording of the song because we, okay.

01:11:24.476 –> 01:11:25.196
Lizzy McAlpine: There’s so many things.

01:11:25.196 –> 01:11:26.676
Lizzy McAlpine: This song is so layered.

01:11:26.856 –> 01:11:27.956
Mason Stoops: It’s been all over.

01:11:27.956 –> 01:11:33.676
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, because we were playing this on tour in the beginning of our tour because we knew it was going to be on Deluxe.

01:11:33.676 –> 01:11:36.056
Lizzy McAlpine: And we came up with this whole live arrangement.

01:11:36.056 –> 01:11:37.536
Lizzy McAlpine: That was cool.

01:11:37.536 –> 01:11:38.576
Lizzy McAlpine: I’ll play that first.

01:11:38.576 –> 01:11:46.296
Mason Stoops: Yeah, but that live arrangement also like kind of changed every night because we were exploring how to make it work.

01:11:46.296 –> 01:11:57.316
Mason Stoops: And that was probably the song that each night afterwards, we’d end up talking the most about like, it’s still not, you know, at one time, Libro and Lizzy and I got together to like, hopefully work on a new form.

01:11:57.316 –> 01:12:01.456
Mason Stoops: And Libro’s idea was just to cut a huge part of it out, which we tried.

01:12:01.456 –> 01:12:03.276
Mason Stoops: We were like, yeah, this is better maybe.

01:12:03.276 –> 01:12:04.076
Mason Stoops: And then we missed it.

01:12:04.076 –> 01:12:04.936
Mason Stoops: We brought it back.

01:12:04.936 –> 01:12:05.856
Lizzy McAlpine: It was all over the place.

01:12:05.856 –> 01:12:07.396
Lizzy McAlpine: We couldn’t really decide on anything.

01:12:07.396 –> 01:12:11.996
Mason Stoops: So like each night, like the audience got to hear like a different version of this song.

01:12:11.996 –> 01:12:16.296
Mason Stoops: And naturally when we got to the final recording of it, it sounds like none of them.

01:12:16.296 –> 01:12:17.396
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

01:12:17.396 –> 01:12:18.216
Lizzy McAlpine: Let me find a place.

01:12:30.900 –> 01:12:32.400
John Kennedy: So what are we hearing there?

01:12:32.400 –> 01:12:35.620
Lizzy McAlpine: This is from DC Night One.

01:12:35.620 –> 01:12:36.540
Mason Stoops: This is a live version.

01:12:36.540 –> 01:12:37.100
Mason Stoops: This is the live version.

01:12:37.100 –> 01:12:38.820
John Kennedy: So this is the live on stage version.

01:12:38.820 –> 01:12:40.000
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

01:12:40.000 –> 01:12:42.200
John Kennedy: Recorded on iPhone again, or?

01:12:42.200 –> 01:12:43.360
Lizzy McAlpine: No, no, no.

01:12:43.360 –> 01:12:45.380
Lizzy McAlpine: We record the board mix.

01:12:45.380 –> 01:12:46.680
Mason Stoops: The desk, right, yeah.

01:12:46.680 –> 01:12:47.640
Mason Stoops: Here, can you rewind a little bit?

01:12:47.640 –> 01:12:53.560
Mason Stoops: Because I realized the echoes that we ended up doing with your vocals on the final, I remember now that that idea came from…

01:12:59.060 –> 01:13:02.300
Lizzy McAlpine: You originally were doing that on guitar.

01:13:02.300 –> 01:13:06.500
Taylor Mackall: My little response there.

01:13:06.500 –> 01:13:07.740
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

01:13:07.740 –> 01:13:09.860
Mason Stoops: With way too much trim, so much trim.

01:13:10.720 –> 01:13:11.800
Lizzy McAlpine: Okay, this part’s cool, though.

01:13:15.700 –> 01:13:23.120
Taylor Mackall: My little arpeggio thing, very, like, kings of convenience, early years.

01:13:23.120 –> 01:13:29.880
Lizzy McAlpine: That’s so cool!

01:13:29.880 –> 01:13:32.660
Lizzy McAlpine: We’re speeding up.

01:13:32.660 –> 01:13:33.120
Mason Stoops: Yeah, we had to…

01:14:24.428 –> 01:14:25.108
Lizzy McAlpine: Cool.

01:14:25.108 –> 01:14:26.368
Mason Stoops: Well, we blew it.

01:14:26.708 –> 01:14:27.688
Mason Stoops: It’s over.

01:14:27.688 –> 01:14:28.808
Mason Stoops: Should have released that.

01:14:28.808 –> 01:14:34.448
Lizzy McAlpine: So yeah, that was the live version that we did, and I love it, listening back to it now, but I don’t think it ever really clicked.

01:14:34.448 –> 01:14:44.288
Lizzy McAlpine: We never found the thing that was really cool for the live version, and so we got into the studio at Electric Lady, and we were like, okay, we’re gonna record this now, I guess.

01:14:44.288 –> 01:14:46.428
Mason Stoops: And it was the last day, too.

01:14:46.428 –> 01:14:50.428
Mason Stoops: We were kind of like, do we even have time to approach this?

01:14:51.528 –> 01:14:53.648
Mason Stoops: It was like the truck was coming to pick up all the gear.

01:14:54.208 –> 01:14:55.848
Lizzy McAlpine: We were like really crunched for time.

01:14:55.848 –> 01:15:07.628
Mason Stoops: So we were almost like, maybe we just pick one of the live, like we just heard pick a live recording and tweak that and make that its best, or just try to recreate our live arrangement, which felt a little too like…

01:15:07.628 –> 01:15:09.128
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, well, we were going to do that.

01:15:09.408 –> 01:15:17.328
Lizzy McAlpine: Our plan was to recreate the live version, and I got into the booth to record my guitars, because I was gonna do like the doubled guitars, which we did.

01:15:17.328 –> 01:15:24.888
Lizzy McAlpine: And I was like, I like was doing the whole song, I was like doing the vocal, and I got to the like, none of it matters part, where that repeats.

01:15:24.888 –> 01:15:27.108
Lizzy McAlpine: And I was like, wait, I forget this melody.

01:15:27.108 –> 01:15:29.868
Lizzy McAlpine: Like, let me listen to my demo that I made to like remember the melody.

01:15:29.868 –> 01:15:34.548
Lizzy McAlpine: And I was playing the demo like in the, into the mic, and Mason was like, what is that?

01:15:34.548 –> 01:15:36.968
Lizzy McAlpine: And I was like, oh, I just like made this like a while ago.

01:15:36.968 –> 01:15:38.208
Lizzy McAlpine: And he was like, wait, what?

01:15:38.208 –> 01:15:39.748
Lizzy McAlpine: Like we need to like do this.

01:15:39.748 –> 01:15:42.328
Mason Stoops: There was this guitar part on her original demo.

01:15:42.328 –> 01:15:45.228
Mason Stoops: This is what I’m talking about.

01:15:45.228 –> 01:15:46.908
Taylor Mackall: We were all like, what the hell is this, man?

01:15:46.908 –> 01:15:47.968
Taylor Mackall: Why were you holding out on that?

01:15:49.208 –> 01:15:50.828
Mason Stoops: Yeah, we’re supposed to be friends.

01:15:51.068 –> 01:15:52.468
Taylor Mackall: We’re supposed to communicate.

01:15:52.468 –> 01:15:55.668
Mason Stoops: I’ve told you all three of my secrets.

01:15:55.668 –> 01:15:58.488
Lizzy McAlpine: Now, let me play this demo because this was like really influential.

01:15:58.488 –> 01:16:00.248
Lizzy McAlpine: It changed our whole approach to the song.

01:16:00.248 –> 01:16:04.708
Mason Stoops: It was like, yeah, the curtains were finally pulled back and we knew what to do with this song.

01:16:04.708 –> 01:16:07.508
Mason Stoops: But it was a part that Lizzy had arranged and written on two guitars.

01:16:07.508 –> 01:16:11.288
Lizzy McAlpine: Because this was the second song that we melded with the first one.

01:16:11.288 –> 01:16:13.688
Lizzy McAlpine: And so it wasn’t like really attached to it.

01:16:13.688 –> 01:16:18.048
Lizzy McAlpine: And I hadn’t listened to it in a while, but then I listened back to it in the studio and I was like, wait, I’m so glad you have this.

01:16:18.048 –> 01:16:18.848
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, let me play it.

01:16:24.328 –> 01:16:26.268
Lizzy McAlpine: Nice change.

01:16:26.268 –> 01:16:27.388
Mason Stoops: Sounds cool.

01:16:28.128 –> 01:16:31.468
Mason Stoops: You really don’t need any of us.

01:16:31.468 –> 01:16:32.908
Mason Stoops: I’m glad to be here.

01:16:32.948 –> 01:16:34.928
Taylor Mackall: I’m grateful for the opportunity.

01:16:34.928 –> 01:16:36.628
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, okay, let’s listen now.

01:17:27.818 –> 01:17:30.178
John Kennedy: So that’s the section that you didn’t share.

01:17:30.178 –> 01:17:32.238
Mason Stoops: She hid that from us for like a year.

01:17:32.258 –> 01:17:39.658
Lizzy McAlpine: Well, I knew, we talked about it, and I was like, I have this other song that I want to incorporate, but I just didn’t know how to yet.

01:17:39.658 –> 01:17:42.358
Lizzy McAlpine: And then we did incorporate it, but I just didn’t play the demo.

01:17:42.358 –> 01:17:46.338
Lizzy McAlpine: Like, I just played you that, but I didn’t play you like the recording of it.

01:17:46.338 –> 01:17:47.798
Mason Stoops: Yeah, you withheld information.

01:17:47.798 –> 01:17:49.578
Lizzy McAlpine: Right, sorry about that.

01:17:49.578 –> 01:17:51.938
John Kennedy: I can understand your reaction though, Taylor.

01:17:51.938 –> 01:17:53.898
John Kennedy: That’s amazing, because it sounds fantastic.

01:17:53.898 –> 01:17:54.798
John Kennedy: Doesn’t that sound cool?

01:17:54.798 –> 01:17:56.198
Taylor Mackall: It’s so sick, who thinks like that?

01:17:56.318 –> 01:17:58.898
Taylor Mackall: It sounds like an old Brazilian composer.

01:17:58.898 –> 01:18:01.378
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:18:01.378 –> 01:18:04.958
Mason Stoops: For me, I was like, okay, I know how we can do this song.

01:18:05.318 –> 01:18:16.718
Mason Stoops: Instead of going for that live version that was like the full band and the tremolo guitars, and it was like, let’s go back to that moment that you had in that demo.

01:18:16.718 –> 01:18:23.258
Mason Stoops: Actually, Taylor and Lizzy ended up going in the other room and relearning her guitar part.

01:18:24.338 –> 01:18:31.478
Mason Stoops: We didn’t have a nylon string with us, but I really wanted that sound, so we asked Electric Lady and Lauren, our assistant, who’s amazing.

01:18:31.478 –> 01:18:33.158
Mason Stoops: She tracked one down.

01:18:33.158 –> 01:18:41.638
Mason Stoops: And the way we recorded it after they transcribed it is Taylor played his part on nylon and Lizzy played her part on steel string.

01:18:41.638 –> 01:18:43.418
Mason Stoops: And then we had him switch guitars.

01:18:43.418 –> 01:18:44.158
Lizzy McAlpine: Then we tracked it again.

01:18:44.158 –> 01:18:46.158
Mason Stoops: And do it again, and then panned those.

01:18:46.158 –> 01:18:50.818
Mason Stoops: So you’re hearing both of them play both guitars, but on opposite sides.

01:18:50.818 –> 01:18:51.538
Lizzy McAlpine: I think this is it.

01:19:01.123 –> 01:19:04.343
John Kennedy: Can you tell who is playing?

01:19:04.343 –> 01:19:04.823
Mason Stoops: I can.

01:19:04.823 –> 01:19:06.023
John Kennedy: Which part?

01:19:06.023 –> 01:19:07.883
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t remember what part I played.

01:19:10.863 –> 01:19:12.063
Taylor Mackall: I’m left.

01:19:13.563 –> 01:19:14.423
Lizzy McAlpine: So cool.

01:19:16.323 –> 01:19:17.603
Taylor Mackall: Let’s hear it again.

01:19:17.603 –> 01:19:18.643
Taylor Mackall: Listen to that counterpoint.

01:19:39.690 –> 01:19:41.570
Lizzy McAlpine: That’s crazy, like how did I come up with that?

01:19:41.570 –> 01:19:43.610
Lizzy McAlpine: I literally don’t know what I was doing.

01:19:43.610 –> 01:19:44.690
Taylor Mackall: That’s the way your mind works.

01:19:44.690 –> 01:19:48.570
Lizzy McAlpine: I was just in my apartment and just like going off, I guess, I don’t know.

01:19:48.570 –> 01:19:54.530
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, that was intense, because the clock was ticking, you know, until like everybody was gonna pick up the gear.

01:19:54.530 –> 01:20:00.510
Taylor Mackall: And I realized we still had that part to do, but there were other things happening on the floor in the studio.

01:20:00.510 –> 01:20:00.950
Taylor Mackall: So I just kind of-

01:20:00.950 –> 01:20:01.750
Lizzy McAlpine: Tensions were a little bit high.

01:20:01.750 –> 01:20:04.190
Taylor Mackall: Tensions were high, yeah, you were moving quickly.

01:20:04.190 –> 01:20:08.290
Taylor Mackall: So I was like, I need to knock out one of these parts and like learn half of it.

01:20:08.590 –> 01:20:10.950
Mason Stoops: Yeah, we just sent Taylor in the hallway, like go figure this out.

01:20:10.950 –> 01:20:23.530
Mason Stoops: Like I also like, I love making, I don’t want to say making, but highly encouraging not guitar players to play guitar parts because they would just play them in really cool ways.

01:20:23.530 –> 01:20:31.570
Mason Stoops: I feel like if I had played it or if Richter or Libra had played it, it just would have sounded too guitar-y, you know, we couldn’t help ourselves.

01:20:31.570 –> 01:20:37.910
Mason Stoops: It would have been like, there’s just something about the way you guys approach that part that feels so much more like McCartney to me.

01:20:38.050 –> 01:20:39.070
Lizzy McAlpine: We do play guitar.

01:20:39.070 –> 01:20:39.490
Mason Stoops: No, I know.

01:20:39.490 –> 01:20:40.590
Mason Stoops: You guys are-

01:20:40.590 –> 01:20:42.970
Lizzy McAlpine: However, we’re not like the main guitarists.

01:20:42.970 –> 01:20:43.490
Mason Stoops: Exactly.

01:20:43.490 –> 01:20:43.890
Mason Stoops: It’s like-

01:20:44.330 –> 01:20:45.510
Lizzy McAlpine: Like lead guitarists.

01:20:45.510 –> 01:20:51.230
Mason Stoops: The obvious choice would have been the other three guitar players, but the coolest choice was having you guys do it.

01:20:51.230 –> 01:20:53.470
Taylor Mackall: We play in non-traditional ways.

01:20:53.470 –> 01:20:53.890
Lizzy McAlpine: Oh yeah.

01:20:53.890 –> 01:20:55.090
John Kennedy: Should we hear it in the mix?

01:20:55.090 –> 01:20:56.250
Mason Stoops: Yeah, put it in context.

01:21:21.389 –> 01:21:22.769
John Kennedy: What else are we hearing in that?

01:21:22.769 –> 01:21:24.749
Mason Stoops: So, the other sounds.

01:21:24.749 –> 01:21:26.729
Lizzy McAlpine: We got some rhythm guitar.

01:21:28.569 –> 01:21:32.149
Lizzy McAlpine: That is not, that is the drums that we took out.

01:21:32.149 –> 01:21:34.109
Mason Stoops: Yeah, drums didn’t make it.

01:21:35.409 –> 01:21:36.849
Mason Stoops: That’s my fretless.

01:21:36.849 –> 01:21:38.649
Lizzy McAlpine: And my rhythm guitar.

01:21:40.729 –> 01:21:41.669
Taylor Mackall: Fretless guitar.

01:21:41.669 –> 01:21:43.989
Mason Stoops: Yeah, I think I put you on 12 string, right?

01:21:43.989 –> 01:21:44.609
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:21:44.609 –> 01:21:45.169
Lizzy McAlpine: That was you.

01:21:45.169 –> 01:21:46.509
Mason Stoops: Oh, I don’t remember.

01:21:46.509 –> 01:21:51.589
Taylor Mackall: There’s only like three of those in the world, custom-built by this guy, Duncan.

01:21:51.589 –> 01:21:52.569
Mason Stoops: Duncan Price.

01:21:52.569 –> 01:21:54.529
Lizzy McAlpine: And also the Steels are on this too.

01:21:54.529 –> 01:21:54.789
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:21:54.789 –> 01:21:59.969
Mason Stoops: So this is another, this kind of goes back to our formula of our Steel ensemble.

01:21:59.969 –> 01:22:10.129
Mason Stoops: And this is one of the times we did this on the main record too, where, yeah, I have this fretless baritone that my friend Duncan made for me.

01:22:10.129 –> 01:22:11.889
Mason Stoops: It’s shaped like Gumby.

01:22:11.889 –> 01:22:13.689
Mason Stoops: I don’t remember how we ended up with that.

01:22:13.829 –> 01:22:15.009
Taylor Mackall: Mason’s hero.

01:22:15.009 –> 01:22:16.529
Mason Stoops: I do love, he’s just like the Everyman.

01:22:16.529 –> 01:22:17.649
Mason Stoops: He’s a good guy.

01:22:17.649 –> 01:22:19.069
Taylor Mackall: Mark Knopfler and Gumby.

01:22:19.069 –> 01:22:20.329
Mason Stoops: Yeah, those are my two guys.

01:22:20.329 –> 01:22:24.629
Mason Stoops: But it’s this fretless guitar that has a sustaining pickup inside of it.

01:22:24.629 –> 01:22:26.809
Mason Stoops: So you can kind of use it as a synth.

01:22:26.809 –> 01:22:27.469
Mason Stoops: You can use it.

01:22:27.469 –> 01:22:29.909
Mason Stoops: I do a lot of like film score, kind of work with it.

01:22:30.029 –> 01:22:33.009
Mason Stoops: It’s very ethereal and strange.

01:22:33.009 –> 01:22:37.329
Mason Stoops: Blake Mills has one and I think he has the first one that Duncan built.

01:22:37.329 –> 01:22:41.269
Mason Stoops: And Blake just shreds on it in a way that, like, you know, you just can’t believe.

01:22:41.909 –> 01:22:49.069
Mason Stoops: So I’ve tried to take it more of the other direction where it’s more emotive, like big kind of wall of sounds.

01:22:49.069 –> 01:22:55.169
Mason Stoops: And so there’s a lot of moments on this that we can hear where you have Nuffer doing high pedal steel strings.

01:22:55.169 –> 01:22:57.769
Mason Stoops: You have Richter kind of filling in that middle gap.

01:22:57.769 –> 01:23:02.489
Mason Stoops: And then it was kind of the, I think it was the last thing we did before they started tearing the room apart.

01:23:02.489 –> 01:23:02.949
Mason Stoops: I knew the whole day.

01:23:02.949 –> 01:23:05.789
Lizzy McAlpine: I think we all like left and you were just still in there.

01:23:05.789 –> 01:23:11.889
Mason Stoops: I knew it was like, we have to put fretless on this because that’s the final element to complete that picture.

01:23:11.889 –> 01:23:19.449
Mason Stoops: That this, all these fretless moving, no one quite landing on a chord, but everyone kind of skirting by them on the way to the next one.

01:23:19.449 –> 01:23:22.589
Mason Stoops: And so that was another like one pass situation.

01:23:22.589 –> 01:23:25.989
Mason Stoops: I would have loved to do a second one, but we were just truly out of time.

01:23:25.989 –> 01:23:26.849
Lizzy McAlpine: You did great.

01:23:26.849 –> 01:23:27.389
Mason Stoops: Thank you.

01:23:27.389 –> 01:23:34.549
Mason Stoops: That was another stereo thing too where I have two amps and the fretless is doing kind of a delay between two amps.

01:23:34.549 –> 01:23:37.089
Mason Stoops: So you get this kind of pulling on itself as it’s going.

01:23:37.809 –> 01:23:38.989
Mason Stoops: I don’t know if we can isolate it.

01:23:38.989 –> 01:23:41.669
Mason Stoops: I certainly would love to try, especially with the steels.

01:23:44.189 –> 01:23:45.549
Mason Stoops: Oh, and Taylor’s Rhodes.

01:23:45.549 –> 01:23:48.909
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, Lizzy and I wrote a Rhodes part, mostly Lizzy.

01:23:48.909 –> 01:23:53.329
Taylor Mackall: And we just worked it out where we both played Fender Rhodes at the same time.

01:23:54.689 –> 01:23:57.229
Taylor Mackall: Then the piano is doubling it.

01:23:57.229 –> 01:23:57.869
Taylor Mackall: That’s the only…

01:23:59.389 –> 01:24:01.069
Mason Stoops: That’s Richter on the…

01:24:04.429 –> 01:24:05.649
Mason Stoops: But can we go to the beginning?

01:24:05.649 –> 01:24:10.589
Mason Stoops: Because there’s another weird little element that I think is fun.

01:24:10.589 –> 01:24:11.809
Mason Stoops: Yeah, this.

01:24:13.589 –> 01:24:21.189
Mason Stoops: That’s just the fretless guitar going through a reverse stereo pedal made by Chase Bliss Audio.

01:24:21.189 –> 01:24:23.949
Mason Stoops: That’s just splitting it up and sending it backwards and forwards.

01:24:24.149 –> 01:24:24.269
Mason Stoops: Like…

01:24:31.872 –> 01:24:33.992
Mason Stoops: Yeah, that’s just a wrong note.

01:24:33.992 –> 01:24:36.852
Mason Stoops: That’s just like, we have one take.

01:24:36.852 –> 01:24:38.752
Mason Stoops: I don’t even know what we’re going to do.

01:24:38.752 –> 01:24:40.072
Mason Stoops: It’s so cool.

01:24:40.072 –> 01:24:44.292
Mason Stoops: But yeah, you have to leave room for magic.

01:24:44.292 –> 01:24:49.892
Mason Stoops: And sometimes magic is making a horrible mistake or incredibly wrong note.

01:24:49.892 –> 01:24:57.192
John Kennedy: Do you think there was some serendipity to the fact that you had to leave that day, that you had to back up and it forced you to concentrate and get on with it?

01:24:57.532 –> 01:25:00.952
Lizzy McAlpine: I mean, because we recorded things after, but it was all my vocals.

01:25:00.952 –> 01:25:04.232
Lizzy McAlpine: Like I had to redo some vocals after these four days.

01:25:04.232 –> 01:25:07.952
Lizzy McAlpine: And I added the BGVs on here after the fact.

01:25:07.952 –> 01:25:10.912
Lizzy McAlpine: But all the instruments we had to get done that day.

01:25:10.912 –> 01:25:15.272
Mason Stoops: I mean, even if you go to the, we have another song on the Deluxe called Soccer Practice.

01:25:15.272 –> 01:25:20.972
Mason Stoops: And there’s this beautiful, just emotive, like weird stretched out outro.

01:25:20.972 –> 01:25:24.352
Mason Stoops: And there’s a reverse piano on there.

01:25:24.352 –> 01:25:26.612
Mason Stoops: That’s the big grand piano on that bottom floor.

01:25:27.212 –> 01:25:35.912
Mason Stoops: But we literally, I was just kind of yelling at Taylor to play, like play the chords from that song as low as possible on the piano.

01:25:35.912 –> 01:25:38.372
Mason Stoops: And as many long drawn out ways as you can.

01:25:38.372 –> 01:25:45.252
Mason Stoops: But while he was doing that, the crew and everyone was in the room packing gear up and slamming flight cases.

01:25:45.252 –> 01:25:48.052
Mason Stoops: And people were like taking photos because of the job, like, oh, we’re all done.

01:25:48.052 –> 01:25:48.492
Mason Stoops: We did it.

01:25:48.492 –> 01:25:58.132
Mason Stoops: But no one knew that we were actually still recording because I wanted this, because we had to, first of all, embrace the fact that everyone was there and our time was up.

01:25:58.132 –> 01:26:01.452
Mason Stoops: But we were truly, we were using every last second we could there.

01:26:01.452 –> 01:26:11.212
Mason Stoops: So on that outro, you just hear this reversed low, like evil piano and then just these bizarre clatterings of sounds and kind of people and things.

01:26:11.212 –> 01:26:12.592
Mason Stoops: And it’s really indistinct.

01:26:12.592 –> 01:26:16.292
Mason Stoops: But all that is, is people packing up and leaving the studio.

01:26:16.292 –> 01:26:19.912
Mason Stoops: And Taylor just anonymously just playing chords.

01:26:20.172 –> 01:26:21.552
Lizzy McAlpine: I think I walked up to him at one point.

01:26:21.552 –> 01:26:22.692
Lizzy McAlpine: I was like, what are you doing?

01:26:22.692 –> 01:26:23.932
Lizzy McAlpine: He’s like, I think I’m recording.

01:26:24.032 –> 01:26:25.792
Lizzy McAlpine: I was like, oh, my God.

01:26:25.792 –> 01:26:26.632
John Kennedy: Whoops.

01:26:26.632 –> 01:26:32.812
Mason Stoops: So we truly used as much time as we could in that space and used as much of that space as we could in the time that we had.

01:26:32.812 –> 01:26:38.232
Mason Stoops: So even on this song, like as much as the Rhodes that was there, the vibraphone that was there.

01:26:38.232 –> 01:26:39.112
Lizzy McAlpine: Solo that.

01:26:39.172 –> 01:26:47.532
Taylor Mackall: The piano at the beginning is doing those responses that Mason came up with for the live arrangement.

01:26:50.432 –> 01:26:52.012
Lizzy McAlpine: And then you doubled it on piano.

01:26:52.012 –> 01:26:54.632
Mason Stoops: Right.

01:26:54.632 –> 01:26:57.672
Lizzy McAlpine: I think that Rhodes is in a different track, weirdly.

01:26:57.672 –> 01:26:58.572
Lizzy McAlpine: But this is just the piano.

01:26:59.232 –> 01:27:02.832
Mason Stoops: Your vocal responses that started as my guitar response.

01:27:02.832 –> 01:27:03.312
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

01:27:03.312 –> 01:27:04.952
Mason Stoops: The nobodies.

01:27:04.952 –> 01:27:08.992
Mason Stoops: So it’s a beautiful tribute to all the live ideas we had over the year.

01:27:14.732 –> 01:27:21.412
Mason Stoops: Yeah, initially I was playing those on guitar, almost because I knew something should be doing them, but I didn’t know what.

01:27:27.652 –> 01:27:32.292
Mason Stoops: Then Lizzy had the idea to just make it a vocal part, it’s like a response.

01:27:32.292 –> 01:27:33.352
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:27:33.352 –> 01:27:36.192
Lizzy McAlpine: I also, I just, sorry, I love these background vocals so much.

01:27:51.082 –> 01:27:52.562
John Kennedy: And is that all Lizzy?

01:27:52.562 –> 01:27:52.822
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:27:52.822 –> 01:27:54.322
David: Yeah.

01:27:54.322 –> 01:27:55.882
John Kennedy: How many Lizzy’s in there?

01:27:55.882 –> 01:27:57.762
Mason Stoops: You never really know.

01:27:57.762 –> 01:27:59.822
Mason Stoops: Probably just like, Not too many.

01:27:59.822 –> 01:28:00.262
Lizzy McAlpine: Two.

01:28:00.262 –> 01:28:01.002
Mason Stoops: Yeah, two or three.

01:28:01.002 –> 01:28:02.682
Lizzy McAlpine: Maybe four, two or four.

01:28:02.682 –> 01:28:06.602
Mason Stoops: Lizzy is crazy in that, like, initially we weren’t even gonna do those parts.

01:28:06.602 –> 01:28:08.802
Mason Stoops: We were there to do, track some other vocal things.

01:28:08.802 –> 01:28:10.222
Lizzy McAlpine: Well, cause I did that later, right?

01:28:10.222 –> 01:28:16.082
Mason Stoops: Yeah, we just came in to, we went back to Nuffer Ranch to just retrack some vocals.

01:28:16.082 –> 01:28:25.862
Mason Stoops: And there’s a, you went in the live room to track a vocal, and then she like burst it in the control room, just being like, I’m hearing this vocal, I’m hearing a background part that we have to do right now.

01:28:25.862 –> 01:28:27.522
Mason Stoops: I mean, that’s allowed.

01:28:27.522 –> 01:28:28.622
Lizzy McAlpine: Isn’t that the one in the…

01:28:28.622 –> 01:28:30.082
Lizzy McAlpine: What a constant…

01:28:30.082 –> 01:28:33.462
Mason Stoops: No, it was that low one we just heard.

01:28:33.462 –> 01:28:35.482
Lizzy McAlpine: I did this at Electric Lady.

01:28:35.482 –> 01:28:36.462
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

01:28:36.462 –> 01:28:38.182
Mason Stoops: No, the one we were just listening to.

01:28:38.182 –> 01:28:39.442
Lizzy McAlpine: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:28:39.442 –> 01:28:40.042
Lizzy McAlpine: Nuffer Ranch, yeah.

01:28:40.042 –> 01:28:40.502
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:28:40.502 –> 01:28:41.742
Lizzy McAlpine: Oh my God, what?

01:28:41.742 –> 01:28:43.662
Mason Stoops: You’re good, you’re good.

01:28:44.702 –> 01:28:48.762
Mason Stoops: But it was just, it was like this thing that had to come out of her in that exact moment.

01:28:48.762 –> 01:28:50.702
Mason Stoops: It’s like we have to do this vocal part right now.

01:28:50.702 –> 01:28:51.842
Lizzy McAlpine: I just love Harmony so much.

01:28:51.842 –> 01:28:56.202
Mason Stoops: I remember sitting there with Jessie as you were doing it and just like, fucking A, she was right.

01:28:56.202 –> 01:29:06.022
Mason Stoops: Like we needed this, you know, and I love this idea that like good ideas is like just this like beach ball that kind of bounces around from one person to the others.

01:29:06.022 –> 01:29:07.682
Mason Stoops: No one is responsible for everything.

01:29:07.682 –> 01:29:12.062
Mason Stoops: It is just like someone has someone struck with the lightning in a moment and you just have to like, let’s do it.

01:29:12.062 –> 01:29:12.562
Mason Stoops: Let’s hear it.

01:29:12.562 –> 01:29:23.742
Mason Stoops: You could always take it out later, but we have to, you know, if someone’s excited about something or compelled for something, you know, I think his pedal steel part on this too, he was like, I’m actually hearing something.

01:29:23.742 –> 01:29:28.782
Mason Stoops: Just force them in there and see what happens, you know, as you can gather.

01:29:28.782 –> 01:29:36.062
Mason Stoops: None of this is planned as much as it is just like choreographed kind of chaos as we were on a tight line.

01:29:36.062 –> 01:29:38.162
Lizzy McAlpine: You know, it’s just like one moment to the next.

01:29:38.162 –> 01:29:38.662
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:29:38.662 –> 01:29:40.362
Lizzy McAlpine: One second and to the next.

01:29:40.362 –> 01:29:40.942
Mason Stoops: All right, we got to go.

01:29:43.302 –> 01:29:46.362
John Kennedy: It’s great, though, and I love the urgency of it.

01:29:46.362 –> 01:29:48.902
John Kennedy: And now that kind of need, you’ve got to do it.

01:29:49.122 –> 01:29:54.802
John Kennedy: And being able to respond to that and capturing that and being so open to everybody’s ideas as well.

01:29:55.142 –> 01:29:59.402
Mason Stoops: That’s the trick, really encouraging everyone.

01:29:59.842 –> 01:30:09.222
Mason Stoops: I feel like I’ve been in so many sessions over the years where it’s like there’s clearly someone in charge and then there’s people who aren’t and there’s people who can give ideas and there are people who can’t.

01:30:09.982 –> 01:30:20.962
Mason Stoops: And I’ve really, my dream is to make everybody feel like super integral, even like Jesse, our engineer, like he’s a part of the band as much as I am or Taylor or Lizzy.

01:30:21.002 –> 01:30:24.242
Lizzy McAlpine: Well, he did some BGVs on Spring into Summer.

01:30:24.242 –> 01:30:27.202
Lizzy McAlpine: We all stood around and sang at the end.

01:30:27.202 –> 01:30:28.902
Mason Stoops: And the Wilburys guitars were his idea.

01:30:28.902 –> 01:30:35.362
Lizzy McAlpine: Everyone in the room, when we do like a gang vocal, like we did at the end of Spring into Summer, I force everyone in the room to do it.

01:30:35.362 –> 01:30:38.602
Lizzy McAlpine: So Molly was there singing and Jesse and Lauren.

01:30:38.862 –> 01:30:41.002
Lizzy McAlpine: And literally like everyone who was there.

01:30:41.002 –> 01:30:42.622
Lizzy McAlpine: I was like, we’re all going to be singing now.

01:30:42.622 –> 01:30:45.602
John Kennedy: We have a Patreon question that kind of relates to that in a way.

01:30:45.602 –> 01:30:46.862
John Kennedy: We’ve got quite a few Patreon questions.

01:30:47.642 –> 01:30:49.242
John Kennedy: One that came from Valentine Music.

01:30:49.242 –> 01:30:52.342
John Kennedy: So, hi Lizzy, first of all, congratulations on your amazing new album.

01:30:52.342 –> 01:30:54.382
John Kennedy: Seeing you play it live was a great experience.

01:30:54.382 –> 01:31:01.862
John Kennedy: My question for you is, with many of your songs using very complex harmony and chord structures at times, do you attribute that to your time at Berklee?

01:31:01.862 –> 01:31:05.162
John Kennedy: Or have you always been interested in non-standard chords?

01:31:05.162 –> 01:31:06.702
Lizzy McAlpine: I never think about it.

01:31:06.702 –> 01:31:07.882
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t know what I’m playing.

01:31:08.002 –> 01:31:11.722
Lizzy McAlpine: If you ask me what chords they are, I don’t have any idea.

01:31:11.722 –> 01:31:13.042
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t know anything.

01:31:13.042 –> 01:31:16.622
Lizzy McAlpine: I just play what sounds good.

01:31:16.622 –> 01:31:19.962
Lizzy McAlpine: I just make it up as I go along.

01:31:19.962 –> 01:31:23.562
Lizzy McAlpine: If it sounds cool, then I’ll keep it.

01:31:23.562 –> 01:31:26.722
Lizzy McAlpine: I’ll let other people figure out what the chords are.

01:31:26.722 –> 01:31:29.942
Lizzy McAlpine: You need to know them to play along with me, but I don’t need to know anything.

01:31:29.942 –> 01:31:31.122
Mason Stoops: Taylor needs to know them.

01:31:31.122 –> 01:31:31.722
Lizzy McAlpine: Right.

01:31:31.722 –> 01:31:32.862
Taylor Mackall: I want to know them.

01:31:32.862 –> 01:31:33.202
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

01:31:33.242 –> 01:31:35.162
Taylor Mackall: It’s my love language, but you don’t need that.

01:31:35.842 –> 01:31:36.182
Taylor Mackall: Yeah.

01:31:36.182 –> 01:31:40.462
Taylor Mackall: It’s kind of cool, that idea of having beginner’s mind in that way.

01:31:40.462 –> 01:31:43.422
Taylor Mackall: Lizzy can read anything with sheet music.

01:31:43.422 –> 01:31:49.602
Taylor Mackall: It’s one of her many, many gifts, but the fact that you don’t know chords in that way.

01:31:49.622 –> 01:31:59.082
Lizzy McAlpine: I know basics, but when I was at Berkeley, the music theory classes went totally over my head.

01:31:59.082 –> 01:32:01.562
Lizzy McAlpine: They were like, listen to this chord and tell me what chord it is.

01:32:01.562 –> 01:32:03.642
Lizzy McAlpine: I’m like, I don’t know.

01:32:03.642 –> 01:32:04.742
Lizzy McAlpine: How are people doing this?

01:32:04.902 –> 01:32:06.762
Lizzy McAlpine: I have no idea.

01:32:06.762 –> 01:32:11.362
Taylor Mackall: For the way you write, it almost serves you to not, because it makes it limitless.

01:32:11.362 –> 01:32:14.582
Mason Stoops: Is it true that chicken nuggets at Berkeley are really good?

01:32:14.582 –> 01:32:16.042
Lizzy McAlpine: They are incredible.

01:32:16.042 –> 01:32:16.962
Mason Stoops: I’ve heard that to be true.

01:32:16.962 –> 01:32:18.662
Lizzy McAlpine: They’re actually kind of better than McDonald’s.

01:32:18.662 –> 01:32:19.562
Taylor Mackall: I’m not going to lie.

01:32:19.562 –> 01:32:20.062
Mason Stoops: All right.

01:32:20.062 –> 01:32:23.862
Mason Stoops: Well, we can delete that because obviously McDonald’s is one of our main sponsors.

01:32:23.862 –> 01:32:26.922
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, don’t tell them we said that.

01:32:26.922 –> 01:32:28.202
Mason Stoops: Next question.

01:32:29.802 –> 01:32:31.462
John Kennedy: I mentioned we’ve got some Patreon questions.

01:32:31.462 –> 01:32:32.742
John Kennedy: We’re going to go on to those in just a moment.

01:32:32.782 –> 01:32:36.822
John Kennedy: And we also have the questions that we always ask everybody who comes on Tape Notes.

01:32:36.822 –> 01:32:41.222
John Kennedy: So maybe we should wrap up Force of Nature by hearing another part of it or the ending maybe.

01:32:41.222 –> 01:32:41.962
Mason Stoops: Yeah, end it.

01:33:46.973 –> 01:33:49.673
Lizzy McAlpine: I love that last verse so much.

01:33:49.673 –> 01:33:50.613
John Kennedy: Beautiful stuff.

01:33:50.613 –> 01:33:56.533
John Kennedy: So that is Force of Nature, Lizzy McAlpine from Older and Wiser, the deluxe version.

01:33:56.533 –> 01:33:58.453
John Kennedy: And I mentioned the Patreon questions.

01:33:58.453 –> 01:34:00.593
John Kennedy: The next one comes from Nightfall.

01:34:00.593 –> 01:34:11.393
John Kennedy: I know Lizzy got her start recording herself doing very raw performances on TikTok, so I’m curious what her approach to content was like at the beginning of her career, and what her advice to artists in a similar position might be now.

01:34:11.393 –> 01:34:13.133
Lizzy McAlpine: Well, I actually did not start on TikTok.

01:34:15.033 –> 01:34:19.153
Lizzy McAlpine: I started, yeah, just posting covers on Instagram.

01:34:19.153 –> 01:34:20.533
Lizzy McAlpine: Well, I really started on SoundCloud.

01:34:20.533 –> 01:34:22.853
Lizzy McAlpine: I started posting stuff like in middle school.

01:34:22.853 –> 01:35:03.553
Lizzy McAlpine: It wasn’t good and it’s not there anymore because it’s not good, but I would do that and then when COVID happened, I was at Berkeley and I kind of had to do the rest of the semester online, and so I was just at home bored, so I would cover artists and then they would see them, and then that’s how I was like kind of growing my fan base, and it’s interesting now with TikTok because when I started posting on TikTok, it’s just like TikTok is a weird place, but I mean, that’s obviously like where my song ceilings blew up, and it has allowed me to do many, many things in my career that I would not have been able to do if that song hadn’t blown up on there, and yeah, I just think like, I don’t know.

01:35:03.553 –> 01:35:04.993
Lizzy McAlpine: What was the first part of the question?

01:35:04.993 –> 01:35:07.293
John Kennedy: I think Nightfall is looking for advice really.

01:35:07.793 –> 01:35:09.093
John Kennedy: Do you see it as worthwhile?

01:35:09.093 –> 01:35:10.413
John Kennedy: I mean, it is worthwhile, isn’t it?

01:35:10.413 –> 01:35:10.753
Lizzy McAlpine: Totally.

01:35:10.753 –> 01:35:12.273
Lizzy McAlpine: I mean, you have to put yourself out there.

01:35:12.273 –> 01:35:12.833
John Kennedy: Yeah.

01:35:12.833 –> 01:35:23.673
Lizzy McAlpine: And I also just think doing it a lot, like just writing a lot or like singing a lot or just doing your craft a lot will like, I don’t know if that’s what worked for me.

01:35:23.673 –> 01:35:24.973
Lizzy McAlpine: I’ve been doing this for a long time.

01:35:24.973 –> 01:35:27.633
Lizzy McAlpine: I’ve been singing forever, writing since I was like 12.

01:35:27.633 –> 01:35:30.493
Lizzy McAlpine: Like it only gets better.

01:35:30.493 –> 01:35:40.033
Lizzy McAlpine: And if you keep posting and just like, keep putting yourself out there and like going to open mics and like singing things, you know, I don’t know what else is out there.

01:35:40.033 –> 01:35:41.473
Lizzy McAlpine: I was an open mic, I didn’t really do that.

01:35:42.313 –> 01:35:45.373
Lizzy McAlpine: But yeah, I think that’s the only way to do it, is keep doing it.

01:35:45.373 –> 01:35:45.793
John Kennedy: Yeah.

01:35:45.793 –> 01:35:58.133
Mason Stoops: How close were you, when you were posting covers, were you, cause I do think that’s actually really important part of like something you said of posting a cover of a song that you like and tagging the artists, like trying to get it out there.

01:35:58.133 –> 01:36:02.473
Mason Stoops: But how close were you covering it in terms of like, were you matching the arrangement exactly?

01:36:02.513 –> 01:36:05.673
Lizzy McAlpine: No, no, I was making it my own.

01:36:05.933 –> 01:36:08.073
Lizzy McAlpine: And I would always do cover videos.

01:36:08.073 –> 01:36:10.833
Lizzy McAlpine: That’s like really all I did up until a certain point.

01:36:10.833 –> 01:36:12.013
Lizzy McAlpine: Like I didn’t really post originals.

01:36:12.013 –> 01:36:14.833
Lizzy McAlpine: I did it a couple of times, but it was mostly covers.

01:36:14.833 –> 01:36:17.993
Lizzy McAlpine: And I would like record a video.

01:36:17.993 –> 01:36:19.313
Lizzy McAlpine: I would arrange it in a different way.

01:36:19.313 –> 01:36:22.793
Lizzy McAlpine: And then I would put it into Logic and record harmonies over the video.

01:36:22.793 –> 01:36:25.133
Lizzy McAlpine: So that was like the vibe that I did.

01:36:25.133 –> 01:36:27.173
Mason Stoops: So that, so I made it my own.

01:36:27.173 –> 01:36:27.753
Mason Stoops: Yeah, exactly.

01:36:27.753 –> 01:36:37.113
Mason Stoops: I think that’s like maybe the main takeaway for someone who’s asking like that is, you know, using material that’s out there that’s especially if it’s an artist that has a presence online already.

01:36:37.113 –> 01:36:43.013
Mason Stoops: But I think maybe what makes your thing so special is your arrangements and your ideas that you bring to it.

01:36:43.013 –> 01:36:46.893
Mason Stoops: And that make that now make them, you know, so uniquely yours.

01:36:46.893 –> 01:36:55.573
Mason Stoops: But, you know, you’re kind of getting at least approaching like a direct audience with the artists that you look up to by tagging them and or at least their fans will see it.

01:36:55.573 –> 01:36:57.633
Lizzy McAlpine: So that’s how I met like Jacob Collier.

01:36:57.633 –> 01:36:58.713
Lizzy McAlpine: That’s how I met Phineas.

01:36:58.713 –> 01:37:02.973
Lizzy McAlpine: Like I was just covering their songs on Instagram and then they followed me and then we became friends.

01:37:03.253 –> 01:37:04.073
John Kennedy: Wow.

01:37:04.073 –> 01:37:04.693
John Kennedy: Amazing.

01:37:05.253 –> 01:37:05.653
John Kennedy: Yeah.

01:37:05.653 –> 01:37:07.933
John Kennedy: That shows how helpful it can be.

01:37:08.253 –> 01:37:10.073
John Kennedy: Amazing.

01:37:10.073 –> 01:37:12.913
John Kennedy: William Card says, I loved your live show for the new record.

01:37:12.913 –> 01:37:16.053
John Kennedy: I was at Radio City this time last year in New York City.

01:37:16.053 –> 01:37:22.613
John Kennedy: I’m wondering if you could speak to the process of how you reimagined your old work in the sonic context of the new band.

01:37:22.613 –> 01:37:27.433
John Kennedy: You’ve mentioned how those songs feel like a lifetime ago, but I wonder how you feel re-approaching them.

01:37:27.433 –> 01:37:28.693
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s been really fun, honestly.

01:37:28.693 –> 01:37:31.253
Lizzy McAlpine: We only play Doomsday and Ceilings in the live show.

01:37:32.033 –> 01:37:33.273
Mason Stoops: And they’re nothing like…

01:37:33.273 –> 01:37:39.373
Lizzy McAlpine: And we really try to really incorporate them into our band vibe.

01:37:39.373 –> 01:37:40.053
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s been really fun.

01:37:40.053 –> 01:37:43.933
Lizzy McAlpine: Doomsday has taken on a kind of western vibe.

01:37:43.933 –> 01:37:45.793
Lizzy McAlpine: Taylor does an organ solo at the end.

01:37:45.793 –> 01:37:47.393
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s really cool.

01:37:47.933 –> 01:37:49.553
Taylor Mackall: Remy has a drum intro.

01:37:49.553 –> 01:37:51.853
Taylor Mackall: Just really, really sick.

01:37:51.933 –> 01:37:57.273
Lizzy McAlpine: And then Ceilings is like, we tried to do more of like a synth based kind of slower.

01:37:57.273 –> 01:38:00.873
Mason Stoops: Well, yeah, I mean, we went.

01:38:00.873 –> 01:38:02.813
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, we got to say it, man.

01:38:02.813 –> 01:38:04.293
Lizzy McAlpine: Mason has never heard the song.

01:38:04.293 –> 01:38:04.973
Mason Stoops: I’ve never heard.

01:38:05.033 –> 01:38:09.893
Lizzy McAlpine: Well, he knows what the song sounds like because I played it for him, but he’s never heard the recording and he doesn’t want to.

01:38:09.893 –> 01:38:14.733
Mason Stoops: Well, I mean, I want I told myself maybe after Dublin, when we wrap up this tour, it would be a good time to hear it.

01:38:14.733 –> 01:38:25.373
Mason Stoops: But when we were arranging the live set and Lizzy was saying that she wanted it to be different, I thought like I should utilize the fact that I’ve never actually heard this song and like, can you just play it for me?

01:38:25.373 –> 01:38:34.453
Mason Stoops: And let’s imagine like as if, you know, you were bringing this song to us for the first time and we didn’t have this recording to go off of how would we as a band and interpret it?

01:38:34.453 –> 01:38:35.893
Mason Stoops: And that’s kind of how Doomsday worked, too.

01:38:35.893 –> 01:38:43.933
Mason Stoops: I don’t I think I’ve heard the recording of Doomsday, but I mostly know the way we play it because that’s just how it naturally worked for us as a band.

01:38:43.933 –> 01:38:46.933
Mason Stoops: And so for Ceilings, that’s just like the way we play it live now.

01:38:47.493 –> 01:38:51.513
Mason Stoops: It’s just the way that felt cool to do it as a band.

01:38:51.513 –> 01:38:53.733
Mason Stoops: I’ve heard yours is quite good.

01:38:53.733 –> 01:38:55.913
Mason Stoops: I would like to hear it sometimes.

01:38:55.913 –> 01:38:57.653
Lizzy McAlpine: Maybe one day, maybe after the tour is over.

01:38:57.653 –> 01:38:59.933
John Kennedy: It shows how the song is the song.

01:38:59.933 –> 01:39:00.633
Mason Stoops: Exactly.

01:39:00.633 –> 01:39:03.773
John Kennedy: So you heard the song and you played the song.

01:39:03.773 –> 01:39:04.653
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:39:04.853 –> 01:39:10.233
John Kennedy: And we kind of had that illustrated by the version of Elevator we heard at the start of the episode in a way.

01:39:10.233 –> 01:39:12.233
Mason Stoops: Yeah, it just felt like this is how we do it.

01:39:15.353 –> 01:39:18.213
John Kennedy: You went to see them play in a band.

01:39:18.213 –> 01:39:21.553
John Kennedy: What’s the band and do you reconvene this band?

01:39:21.553 –> 01:39:23.353
Lizzy McAlpine: Well, they were playing with Ryan Beatty.

01:39:23.353 –> 01:39:23.813
John Kennedy: Right.

01:39:23.813 –> 01:39:25.933
Lizzy McAlpine: And do you want to talk about it?

01:39:25.933 –> 01:39:26.153
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:39:26.153 –> 01:39:37.493
Mason Stoops: I mean, we toured with Ryan starting in November, October of last year and we’re all super fans of Ryan.

01:39:38.373 –> 01:39:41.753
Mason Stoops: His producer, Ethan Greska, is a friend of mine who brought me in.

01:39:41.753 –> 01:39:43.753
Lizzy McAlpine: Ethan co-wrote one of the songs on Deluxe with me.

01:39:43.753 –> 01:39:44.613
Mason Stoops: Oh, that’s right.

01:39:44.613 –> 01:39:52.413
Mason Stoops: But Ethan brought me in to work with Ryan initially for a live version of his album, which then spawned.

01:39:52.553 –> 01:40:04.153
Mason Stoops: I just, you know, did what I always do, which is I call the musicians that I love to work with, which is Taylor and Libro, Ted Poor, because those were the guys that we’d done the Marcus Mumford tour together.

01:40:04.153 –> 01:40:05.893
Mason Stoops: And so it’s like, I trust this band.

01:40:05.893 –> 01:40:06.593
Mason Stoops: I love this band.

01:40:06.693 –> 01:40:08.713
Mason Stoops: We have like a really special thing, I feel like.

01:40:08.713 –> 01:40:15.873
Mason Stoops: So that is what developed into when Ryan wanted to tour, it’s like, I’m going to put, let’s just use these guys.

01:40:15.873 –> 01:40:19.933
Mason Stoops: And then we needed to fill out a couple more roles in the string department.

01:40:19.933 –> 01:40:23.593
Mason Stoops: That’s where Richter and Nuffer entered the picture.

01:40:23.593 –> 01:40:27.233
Mason Stoops: And then shortly after that is when Lizzy heard us playing with Ryan.

01:40:27.253 –> 01:40:29.293
Mason Stoops: And I really believe in this band.

01:40:29.293 –> 01:40:35.033
Mason Stoops: I really believe in this project in terms of like, I want to work with these musicians forever.

01:40:35.793 –> 01:40:42.533
Mason Stoops: And the idea was like, this is a unit, like, this is, we’re not, you know, you can’t piece us apart and you can’t just hire out individuals.

01:40:42.533 –> 01:40:49.353
Mason Stoops: And so the idea of growing this this band into something more than just, you know, the guys behind the artists on stage.

01:40:49.353 –> 01:40:54.433
Mason Stoops: Like, we can go in the studio and make something special and we can go on tour and bring that to life.

01:40:55.033 –> 01:41:01.393
Mason Stoops: Kind of treating the studio like a live environment and treating the stage like a studio environment is very much our ethos.

01:41:01.393 –> 01:41:08.353
Mason Stoops: And yeah, I mean, the goal is to just continue growing this and we want to work with each other forever.

01:41:08.353 –> 01:41:13.633
Mason Stoops: You know, I’ll never play with and then their piano player besides Taylor, you know.

01:41:13.633 –> 01:41:14.753
Mason Stoops: We’re all like best friends.

01:41:14.753 –> 01:41:18.613
Mason Stoops: We’re a group of friends that have known each other, some of us for over a decade.

01:41:18.613 –> 01:41:20.073
John Kennedy: You need to name.

01:41:20.073 –> 01:41:21.993
Mason Stoops: Well, we were going with like, we were-

01:41:21.993 –> 01:41:23.053
John Kennedy: Or do you need to name?

01:41:23.053 –> 01:41:23.453
Mason Stoops: I don’t know.

01:41:23.873 –> 01:41:24.753
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, we got-

01:41:24.753 –> 01:41:25.193
Mason Stoops: Do we?

01:41:25.193 –> 01:41:28.113
Taylor Mackall: I mean, it’s colloquial and it’s our thing, but it’s our thing.

01:41:28.113 –> 01:41:32.673
Mason Stoops: Some people call it’s the fun machine because of the keyboard that we use on Lizzy’s record.

01:41:32.673 –> 01:41:35.553
Mason Stoops: But that sounds horrible.

01:41:35.553 –> 01:41:37.673
Mason Stoops: Full Boy Productions came about because-

01:41:37.673 –> 01:41:40.913
Taylor Mackall: Full Boy is the group chat name, so I feel like that’s valid.

01:41:40.913 –> 01:41:45.713
Mason Stoops: Going like something our friend Jacob said about going all the way with something like committing.

01:41:45.713 –> 01:41:52.993
Mason Stoops: When we did this secret show in Aaron Paul’s backyard, we were going to tow an upright piano up this hill to this-

01:41:52.993 –> 01:41:53.893
Taylor Mackall: My piano.

01:41:53.893 –> 01:41:54.433
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:41:54.433 –> 01:41:55.813
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:41:55.813 –> 01:41:57.633
Mason Stoops: When they were like, how do you even do that?

01:41:57.633 –> 01:41:59.013
Mason Stoops: It’s like, we’re just going to go full boy.

01:41:59.013 –> 01:42:00.253
Taylor Mackall: Can’t you just use a keyboard?

01:42:00.253 –> 01:42:02.753
Taylor Mackall: We’re like, yeah, or we could go full boy.

01:42:02.753 –> 01:42:04.153
Taylor Mackall: Then everyone wants to go full boy.

01:42:04.153 –> 01:42:05.033
Taylor Mackall: What is that?

01:42:05.033 –> 01:42:07.693
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, let’s go full boy, I guess.

01:42:07.693 –> 01:42:08.333
John Kennedy: Full Boy.

01:42:08.333 –> 01:42:08.873
Mason Stoops: I don’t know.

01:42:08.873 –> 01:42:09.953
Lizzy McAlpine: Full Boy Productions.

01:42:10.493 –> 01:42:11.653
Mason Stoops: They’re both horrible names.

01:42:11.653 –> 01:42:12.353
Mason Stoops: No, they’re not horrible.

01:42:12.353 –> 01:42:13.573
Taylor Mackall: It’s dumb, but we love it.

01:42:13.573 –> 01:42:14.033
John Kennedy: Yeah.

01:42:14.073 –> 01:42:14.873
Taylor Mackall: You got to lean in.

01:42:14.873 –> 01:42:16.073
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s silly.

01:42:16.073 –> 01:42:24.053
John Kennedy: It’s clearly very special though, which is why the artists like Lizzy are attracted to what you’re doing and what you can bring to it.

01:42:24.053 –> 01:42:26.013
John Kennedy: We can hear the results on this album.

01:42:26.013 –> 01:42:27.573
John Kennedy: It sounds amazing.

01:42:27.573 –> 01:42:30.493
John Kennedy: One more question from Patreon, Ilyasa.

01:42:30.493 –> 01:42:32.773
John Kennedy: Hi Lizzy, me and my sister are such big fans.

01:42:32.773 –> 01:42:38.053
John Kennedy: We were wondering about your process of creating the melodies for your songs as they are always so beautiful and impactful.

01:42:38.053 –> 01:42:41.553
John Kennedy: We were also wondering if you’re interested in self-producing an album in the future.

01:42:42.533 –> 01:42:43.933
Lizzy McAlpine: I mean, totally for the last one.

01:42:43.933 –> 01:42:45.613
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, I’d love to.

01:42:45.613 –> 01:42:47.373
Lizzy McAlpine: We co-produced this album.

01:42:47.373 –> 01:42:50.453
Lizzy McAlpine: And so I feel like that was a step in the right direction.

01:42:50.453 –> 01:42:56.053
Lizzy McAlpine: But as for the first part of the question, how I make my melodies, they kind of just come intuitively.

01:42:56.053 –> 01:42:58.753
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s not really a, like there’s no formula.

01:42:58.753 –> 01:43:04.533
Lizzy McAlpine: I’m not sitting down and like, okay, I’m going to make this melody go like one, five, one.

01:43:04.533 –> 01:43:07.233
Lizzy McAlpine: You know, like it’s not, I’m not like writing it out like that.

01:43:07.233 –> 01:43:08.893
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s just really like intuitive.

01:43:09.193 –> 01:43:15.273
Lizzy McAlpine: And I usually write the melody and the words together because I feel like those, they inform each other.

01:43:15.273 –> 01:43:18.993
Lizzy McAlpine: And yeah, it’s just, it’s like, whatever comes out, comes out.

01:43:18.993 –> 01:43:19.393
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:43:19.393 –> 01:43:20.413
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s really, I don’t think too much about it.

01:43:20.413 –> 01:43:21.373
John Kennedy: I thought it was the Lizzy magic there.

01:43:21.933 –> 01:43:22.773
John Kennedy: It’s just there.

01:43:22.773 –> 01:43:24.973
Mason Stoops: But she always, you always know when it’s right.

01:43:24.973 –> 01:43:25.713
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

01:43:25.713 –> 01:43:28.633
Mason Stoops: She’ll spend a, you know, it’s never like a long time.

01:43:28.633 –> 01:43:35.693
Mason Stoops: Like you’re pretty efficient in a scary way, but she’s very critical of her parts until she knows they’re right.

01:43:35.693 –> 01:43:44.313
Mason Stoops: And we’ve all learned to really just lean in and trust Lizzy’s instincts with those because she, she’s always hearing something that we can’t wait to hear too.

01:43:44.313 –> 01:43:46.593
Mason Stoops: But she’s definitely hearing it before any of us are.

01:43:46.593 –> 01:43:49.293
Mason Stoops: So we just got to let her get there and you always do.

01:43:49.293 –> 01:43:50.833
Taylor Mackall: Yeah.

01:43:50.833 –> 01:43:54.393
John Kennedy: We always ask people on Tape Notes a number of questions.

01:43:54.393 –> 01:44:04.693
John Kennedy: One of them is about tech, equipment, or an instrument, something that you couldn’t live without, or you couldn’t create without, or that is specific to this project.

01:44:04.693 –> 01:44:11.633
John Kennedy: This is an interesting one because this project is so much about live music and responding with real instruments to ideas.

01:44:11.633 –> 01:44:14.233
John Kennedy: But what are you going to suggest?

01:44:14.233 –> 01:44:14.913
Lizzy McAlpine: I have nothing.

01:44:14.913 –> 01:44:15.553
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t think about this.

01:44:15.553 –> 01:44:16.653
Mason Stoops: Everyone should pick one.

01:44:16.653 –> 01:44:17.793
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t know anything.

01:44:18.533 –> 01:44:22.793
Mason Stoops: What’s more, just a sound or a thing on the record that you think is cool?

01:44:22.793 –> 01:44:25.213
Mason Stoops: I mean, you could even say piano, but I think.

01:44:25.213 –> 01:44:25.693
Lizzy McAlpine: I don’t know.

01:44:25.693 –> 01:44:34.073
Lizzy McAlpine: I mean, I liked the way that Jesse set up my mics specifically when we were recording BGVs, he would put the mic so far away from me.

01:44:34.613 –> 01:44:37.353
Lizzy McAlpine: And I was like, this is, is this like working?

01:44:37.353 –> 01:44:39.693
Lizzy McAlpine: And he was like, yeah, and it sounds great.

01:44:39.693 –> 01:44:42.193
Mason Stoops: Yeah, Jesse has, I mean, he’s a genius.

01:44:42.193 –> 01:44:49.153
Mason Stoops: Jesse Honig deserves his own movie in terms of the things that he’s done and the projects he’s worked with and the artists.

01:44:49.153 –> 01:44:50.593
Lizzy McAlpine: He was the most important part of this.

01:44:50.593 –> 01:44:55.413
Lizzy McAlpine: I mean, besides the band, obviously, but like he really made everything sound incredible.

01:44:55.813 –> 01:45:04.793
Mason Stoops: Yeah, I mean, truly his micing techniques for Lizzy’s voice, he really understood kind of where her voice was coming from and did some atypical things, I would say.

01:45:04.793 –> 01:45:08.993
Mason Stoops: We’ve gotten so many people reaching out about the mic placement or what kind of mic it was.

01:45:08.993 –> 01:45:18.813
Mason Stoops: And most of the mics are like just once he made himself because he’s an incredible engineer and he’s circuit designer and he’s designed mics for a bunch of different companies.

01:45:18.813 –> 01:45:25.753
Mason Stoops: So a lot of the mics are just kind of random project mics he’s built, but he’d be the first to tell you like, none of them are special, none of them are magic.

01:45:25.753 –> 01:45:30.873
Mason Stoops: He really believes in like what’s magic is the relationship of whatever gear you’re using with the artist.

01:45:30.873 –> 01:45:38.293
Mason Stoops: So he found really unique places to put him for Lizzy’s voice that I don’t think most people would do.

01:45:38.293 –> 01:45:52.953
Mason Stoops: But when we compared him, when we heard it back, I mean, it was staggering the way he was able to capture more of her or kind of something that felt more deep and personal instead of just like the typical mic right in your mouth thing.

01:45:52.953 –> 01:45:54.573
Mason Stoops: So that’s mine.

01:45:54.573 –> 01:45:54.813
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:45:54.813 –> 01:45:55.593
Lizzy McAlpine: What’s yours?

01:45:55.593 –> 01:45:58.233
Mason Stoops: Mine is Selfishly the Base Six.

01:45:58.233 –> 01:45:59.873
Mason Stoops: Of course.

01:45:59.873 –> 01:46:10.353
Mason Stoops: Because I mean, we kind of leaned into a lot of old school like sounds that maybe aren’t as current in terms of like their use on modern records.

01:46:10.353 –> 01:46:20.613
Mason Stoops: But if you go back to its time, like the Base Six, especially in Nashville and even in LA too, the Wrecking Crew was on every song.

01:46:20.993 –> 01:46:30.993
Mason Stoops: It was there to help reinforce the upright bass, give it that tic-tac sound that they talk about because otherwise, the upright is so dull and woofy, which is cool.

01:46:30.993 –> 01:46:41.293
Mason Stoops: But the Base Six did this thing that gave it a tack and a sharpness, and that became like the sound of the spaghetti western thing and so many great classic country recordings.

01:46:41.653 –> 01:46:43.733
John Kennedy: And so what is the Base Six then?

01:46:43.733 –> 01:46:44.953
Mason Stoops: I’m so glad you asked.

01:46:44.953 –> 01:46:58.433
Mason Stoops: The Base Six was in the era of electric guitars, where electric guitars were like plugins, like the laptop that was new and exciting, and the adults hated it and the kids loved it, you know, in terms of like, this is ruining music.

01:46:58.433 –> 01:47:01.273
Mason Stoops: And the kids are like, this is music, you know.

01:47:01.273 –> 01:47:07.893
Mason Stoops: The Base Six was one of a lot of ideas kind of thrown out there that was like, maybe this will sell, maybe this will be something people want.

01:47:08.013 –> 01:47:12.373
Mason Stoops: But it’s a six-string bass that was kind of geared towards guitar players.

01:47:12.373 –> 01:47:15.233
Mason Stoops: So it’s, imagine a guitar that’s an octave lower.

01:47:15.233 –> 01:47:17.093
Mason Stoops: So it’s in the bass range.

01:47:17.093 –> 01:47:19.513
Mason Stoops: It’s not quite the scale length of most basses.

01:47:19.513 –> 01:47:24.373
Mason Stoops: So it doesn’t have the complete low end, but it does have a really distinct low end.

01:47:24.373 –> 01:47:28.693
Mason Stoops: So it doesn’t ever really step on the bass in terms of like sonically in a mix.

01:47:28.693 –> 01:47:31.753
Mason Stoops: It does an amazing job at reinforcing what a bass is doing.

01:47:31.753 –> 01:47:34.913
Mason Stoops: And it does an amazing job at staying out of the way of guitars as well.

01:47:35.233 –> 01:47:41.453
Mason Stoops: So if you go to Elevator or I guess there’s so many songs on this record that the basics is there.

01:47:41.453 –> 01:47:49.453
Mason Stoops: It’s this very low just guitar that we’ve all heard a thousand times before, but it’s never been the forefront.

01:47:49.453 –> 01:47:53.693
Mason Stoops: You know, it’s kind of there in all these ancient recordings as a reinforcement.

01:47:53.693 –> 01:48:01.493
Mason Stoops: And so I loved bringing it to the forefront of this record as a way to kind of give it a sound that was a little more nostalgic, but it doesn’t jump out.

01:48:01.693 –> 01:48:03.993
Mason Stoops: It’s not demanding your attention in the way a lot of guitars do.

01:48:04.973 –> 01:48:11.253
Mason Stoops: And Dan Electro, which is my favorite guitar company ever, they were the first ones to do a proper bass six.

01:48:11.253 –> 01:48:17.813
Mason Stoops: And so I used an early, like a first year, I think it’s like a 1956 Dan Electro bass six on this record.

01:48:17.813 –> 01:48:20.873
Taylor Mackall: So say, yeah, is that on Wichita Lineman?

01:48:20.873 –> 01:48:21.193
Mason Stoops: It is.

01:48:21.193 –> 01:48:21.373
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:48:21.373 –> 01:48:23.713
Mason Stoops: The solo on Wichita Lineman is a Dan Electro bass six.

01:48:23.713 –> 01:48:24.413
Mason Stoops: Right.

01:48:24.413 –> 01:48:28.033
Mason Stoops: And Carol Kay, like a lot of those Beach Boys recordings, it’s a bass six.

01:48:28.953 –> 01:48:32.593
Mason Stoops: Brendan Lee, Break It to Me Gently, there’s an amazing bass six part.

01:48:32.593 –> 01:48:39.593
Mason Stoops: A lot of the, yeah, any Spaghetti Western track, The Good, The Bad, The Ugly, any Sinatra stuff, yeah, any Amorakoni.

01:48:39.593 –> 01:48:43.113
Mason Stoops: It was on everything for like six years, seven years.

01:48:43.113 –> 01:48:44.073
Taylor Mackall: Bass six awareness.

01:48:44.073 –> 01:48:47.433
Mason Stoops: And then it was like, and then people stopped using it.

01:48:47.433 –> 01:48:48.973
Mason Stoops: And it’s not really a thing.

01:48:49.193 –> 01:48:49.853
Mason Stoops: It’s not utilized.

01:48:49.853 –> 01:48:52.293
Lizzy McAlpine: Well, it’s a thing now because you’re bringing it back.

01:48:52.293 –> 01:48:54.213
Mason Stoops: I’m trying to, I’m working very hard.

01:48:54.213 –> 01:48:55.293
Lizzy McAlpine: I think you’re accomplishing it.

01:48:55.293 –> 01:49:00.613
Mason Stoops: Lizzy announces me every night on stage and this is Mason on guitar and bass six.

01:49:00.613 –> 01:49:01.813
Mason Stoops: So we’re putting it out there.

01:49:01.813 –> 01:49:02.433
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, we are.

01:49:02.973 –> 01:49:04.153
Mason Stoops: I want people to do it.

01:49:04.153 –> 01:49:05.273
Mason Stoops: I want people to steal it.

01:49:05.273 –> 01:49:05.753
Mason Stoops: I want it.

01:49:05.753 –> 01:49:07.613
Mason Stoops: It deserves to be back.

01:49:07.613 –> 01:49:08.113
Lizzy McAlpine: Totally.

01:49:08.113 –> 01:49:08.973
Taylor Mackall: It’s back.

01:49:08.973 –> 01:49:09.613
Taylor Mackall: It’s back, baby.

01:49:09.613 –> 01:49:10.713
Mason Stoops: All right, yours, Taylor.

01:49:10.713 –> 01:49:14.673
Taylor Mackall: I mean, my first one is my upright piano from home.

01:49:14.673 –> 01:49:22.733
Taylor Mackall: I mean, Mason’s always trying to be in alignment with what’s spiritually correct for the project, which I love just in general.

01:49:22.733 –> 01:49:24.953
Taylor Mackall: So he was like, man, you got to bring your upright for the record.

01:49:25.573 –> 01:49:30.713
Taylor Mackall: So I got my movers, Francisco and his crew, to bring my upright piano to Nuffer Ranch.

01:49:30.713 –> 01:49:37.913
Taylor Mackall: And it’s just called like a Willem Grotrian from Germany, originally when it was Steinberg Grotrian.

01:49:37.913 –> 01:49:43.013
Taylor Mackall: But then with my technician, we put like two strips of felt in their fabric, really.

01:49:43.013 –> 01:49:54.073
Taylor Mackall: So you can have like a classic felt sound, like the Ethan Gruska kind of sound that he really made popular, or like a single ply, which is more subdued.

01:49:55.213 –> 01:49:56.713
Mason Stoops: I think Older was the single ply, right?

01:49:56.713 –> 01:49:58.153
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, exactly.

01:49:58.153 –> 01:50:03.613
Taylor Mackall: So yeah, so I felt really comfortable in the studio, just doing my thing on my piano.

01:50:03.613 –> 01:50:04.373
Taylor Mackall: That was special.

01:50:04.373 –> 01:50:06.793
Taylor Mackall: And that was the piano we brought to Aaron Paul’s.

01:50:06.793 –> 01:50:08.113
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:50:08.113 –> 01:50:09.673
Lizzy McAlpine: So it’s a weird piece of lore.

01:50:09.673 –> 01:50:11.433
Taylor Mackall: So it sat there overnight.

01:50:11.433 –> 01:50:13.493
Taylor Mackall: And I was like, Mason, do you think it’s gonna be okay?

01:50:13.493 –> 01:50:14.893
Taylor Mackall: And he goes, yeah, man, it’s a tree.

01:50:14.893 –> 01:50:16.873
Taylor Mackall: It’s a tree, it’ll be fine.

01:50:16.873 –> 01:50:19.133
Mason Stoops: Yeah, it was outside way longer than it’s been inside.

01:50:19.133 –> 01:50:20.333
Taylor Mackall: Yeah, totally, amen.

01:50:22.913 –> 01:50:26.073
Taylor Mackall: And then the fun machine, of course, because we keep talking about it.

01:50:26.073 –> 01:50:28.233
Mason Stoops: The fun machine is the fun machine.

01:50:28.233 –> 01:50:29.993
Mason Stoops: It’s a $30 craigslist find.

01:50:29.993 –> 01:50:35.773
Mason Stoops: It’s a Baldwin little kind of toy synthesizer, but it does sound phenomenal in two settings.

01:50:35.773 –> 01:50:39.493
Mason Stoops: And it does sound horrible in all the others.

01:50:39.493 –> 01:50:41.833
Mason Stoops: But it was an essential part of the record.

01:50:41.833 –> 01:50:43.653
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, you know, I have it on tour every night.

01:50:43.653 –> 01:50:45.813
Mason Stoops: Yeah, it’s been all over the world with us now.

01:50:45.813 –> 01:50:47.833
Mason Stoops: And it’s like a huge part of the record.

01:50:47.833 –> 01:50:50.073
Mason Stoops: It’s the sounds are so special.

01:50:50.153 –> 01:50:53.713
Mason Stoops: We tried to sample it so that we could just use like a Nord or something.

01:50:53.713 –> 01:50:55.413
Mason Stoops: But that felt so spiritually wrong.

01:50:55.413 –> 01:50:56.473
Taylor Mackall: Spiritually incorrect.

01:50:56.473 –> 01:50:58.013
Mason Stoops: So we just bring the fun machine.

01:50:58.013 –> 01:51:00.553
Mason Stoops: And if it breaks, that’s even better.

01:51:00.553 –> 01:51:03.213
Mason Stoops: It’s like it went out with the bang.

01:51:03.213 –> 01:51:06.773
Mason Stoops: It lived in some grandma’s garage for its whole life.

01:51:06.773 –> 01:51:07.973
Mason Stoops: And then it got to see the world.

01:51:07.973 –> 01:51:08.973
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah, that’s so cute.

01:51:08.973 –> 01:51:10.853
Mason Stoops: It’s really beautiful.

01:51:10.853 –> 01:51:14.533
Taylor Mackall: When we were in Australia, we found one on Craigslist down there.

01:51:14.533 –> 01:51:16.173
Taylor Mackall: I think there was only one in the entire-

01:51:16.173 –> 01:51:17.273
Mason Stoops: Probably in all of Australia.

01:51:17.333 –> 01:51:20.093
Taylor Mackall: In all of Australia, and we bought it and we brought it home.

01:51:20.093 –> 01:51:20.873
John Kennedy: Wow.

01:51:20.873 –> 01:51:21.353
Mason Stoops: We had-

01:51:21.353 –> 01:51:22.473
Mason Stoops: Because we wanted to spare-

01:51:22.473 –> 01:51:26.873
Mason Stoops: We kept thinking we need a spare one for this tour, but they’re so hard to find.

01:51:26.873 –> 01:51:28.353
Taylor Mackall: Sorry, Australia.

01:51:28.353 –> 01:51:28.913
Mason Stoops: And we were like-

01:51:28.913 –> 01:51:30.113
Mason Stoops: We took the one.

01:51:30.113 –> 01:51:30.273
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:51:30.273 –> 01:51:32.193
Mason Stoops: We took your one fun machine.

01:51:32.233 –> 01:51:37.433
John Kennedy: But you are creating your own fun machine hub and community, which is a special thing.

01:51:37.433 –> 01:51:39.913
Taylor Mackall: We need all the fun machines we can get, really.

01:51:39.913 –> 01:51:40.993
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:51:40.993 –> 01:51:41.973
Mason Stoops: And it hasn’t broken yet.

01:51:41.973 –> 01:51:46.213
Mason Stoops: I mean, knock on wood, but it’s been great.

01:51:47.413 –> 01:51:50.693
Mason Stoops: So all the people out there who want to say, like, don’t take old stuff on tour.

01:51:50.693 –> 01:51:51.673
Taylor Mackall: Come on, man.

01:51:51.673 –> 01:51:55.393
Mason Stoops: Like have some fun, like let it break and then fix it and then let it break again.

01:51:55.393 –> 01:51:56.453
Mason Stoops: And then call Jesse.

01:51:56.473 –> 01:51:56.773
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:51:56.773 –> 01:51:58.773
Mason Stoops: Call Jesse once again, a genius.

01:51:58.773 –> 01:52:00.933
Mason Stoops: He can fix anything and he’s fixed all of our gear.

01:52:00.933 –> 01:52:04.333
Mason Stoops: So anyway, we love leaning in.

01:52:04.333 –> 01:52:06.333
Mason Stoops: We love going full boy.

01:52:09.213 –> 01:52:16.713
John Kennedy: The other question we ask everybody is about advice, whether you’ve learned anything along the way that you would pass on to other people.

01:52:16.713 –> 01:52:23.813
Lizzy McAlpine: I learned a lot when I was making this album, like really way more than I’ve ever learned making any album before this.

01:52:23.813 –> 01:52:35.413
Lizzy McAlpine: And it really was all about like just trusting myself and not being afraid to like be in charge and take control of my own art.

01:52:35.413 –> 01:52:48.853
Lizzy McAlpine: Like I don’t know why that was so, it’s just been difficult for me in the past, but this album really gave me the space to like be myself and trust that I was making the right decisions and all this stuff.

01:52:48.853 –> 01:52:51.493
Lizzy McAlpine: And yeah, I learned a lot about myself.

01:52:51.493 –> 01:52:52.433
Lizzy McAlpine: It was a long process.

01:52:52.433 –> 01:52:56.733
Lizzy McAlpine: It took like three years to make from the moment I started like really working on it.

01:52:56.733 –> 01:53:04.073
Lizzy McAlpine: And it was also a big lesson to trust the process because we made this album in a different way than I’ve ever made any album.

01:53:04.993 –> 01:53:10.313
Lizzy McAlpine: And my past two albums were like, I was producing it with my mixer.

01:53:10.313 –> 01:53:12.173
Lizzy McAlpine: So we would mix as we went along.

01:53:12.173 –> 01:53:17.433
Lizzy McAlpine: And at the end of each day, I would have like a balance that I could listen to that sounded great because it was basically mixed.

01:53:17.433 –> 01:53:19.813
Lizzy McAlpine: And that was not how we did this album.

01:53:19.833 –> 01:53:22.953
Mason Stoops: Yeah, it’s just not possible when you’re tracking live in a room together.

01:53:22.953 –> 01:53:26.713
Lizzy McAlpine: Because we would just track live and then that was what I would have to listen to.

01:53:26.713 –> 01:53:27.753
Lizzy McAlpine: It wasn’t mixed at all.

01:53:27.753 –> 01:53:28.753
Lizzy McAlpine: It was not balanced.

01:53:29.053 –> 01:53:32.853
Lizzy McAlpine: It was just like, I was like, oh God, it doesn’t sound good.

01:53:33.533 –> 01:53:37.293
Mason Stoops: Like, every other day, you’re like, is it going to sound good?

01:53:37.293 –> 01:53:38.373
Lizzy McAlpine: It was so stressful.

01:53:38.373 –> 01:53:40.513
Lizzy McAlpine: I was just not trusting the process.

01:53:40.513 –> 01:53:46.633
Lizzy McAlpine: It’s very difficult for me, but I did eventually and it worked out how it was meant to.

01:53:46.633 –> 01:53:49.413
Lizzy McAlpine: And it sounds amazing.

01:53:49.413 –> 01:53:49.993
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

01:53:49.993 –> 01:53:51.233
Lizzy McAlpine: It worked out perfectly.

01:53:51.233 –> 01:53:52.233
Mason Stoops: I mean, it’s fun.

01:53:52.233 –> 01:53:58.893
Mason Stoops: It’s fun to be on the other side of it because, even though I was the one telling Lizzy, yes, it’s going to sound great.

01:53:58.993 –> 01:54:01.593
Mason Stoops: Like I promise, like lean in trust.

01:54:01.593 –> 01:54:04.853
Mason Stoops: I’m also like telling that to myself because you don’t really ever know.

01:54:04.853 –> 01:54:07.153
Mason Stoops: I mean, and that that is the risk.

01:54:07.153 –> 01:54:10.733
Mason Stoops: That is the tightrope of making an album the hard way.

01:54:10.733 –> 01:54:16.253
Lizzy McAlpine: You know, I think I just really like leaning into the feeling that we had in the studio.

01:54:16.253 –> 01:54:21.113
Lizzy McAlpine: Like it would always feel really cool when we were there and then I would go home and I would be thinking about it.

01:54:21.113 –> 01:54:22.893
Lizzy McAlpine: And I would be like, oh, my God, it doesn’t sound good.

01:54:22.893 –> 01:54:24.973
Lizzy McAlpine: Like, oh, my God, it’s never going to get finished.

01:54:24.973 –> 01:54:30.693
Lizzy McAlpine: And I just had to remind myself of the way that it felt when we were all in the room, because that’s really like what it was all about.

01:54:31.413 –> 01:54:32.793
Lizzy McAlpine: And I think that got me through.

01:54:32.793 –> 01:54:37.093
Lizzy McAlpine: So, yeah, just trusting myself and trusting the process.

01:54:37.093 –> 01:54:37.653
Mason Stoops: Yeah.

01:54:37.653 –> 01:54:38.453
Lizzy McAlpine: Yeah.

01:54:38.453 –> 01:54:39.573
Taylor Mackall: What about you?

01:54:39.573 –> 01:54:41.533
Taylor Mackall: My advice, please.

01:54:41.533 –> 01:54:42.613
Lizzy McAlpine: Work with your friends.

01:54:42.613 –> 01:54:44.253
Mason Stoops: Work with your friends.

01:54:44.253 –> 01:54:52.033
Mason Stoops: And like kind of going back to what we were talking about, like utilizing the space, utilizing what you have.

01:54:52.033 –> 01:55:03.153
Mason Stoops: You know, Jesse is my hero and he taught me so much about like, here’s everything about why these historic mics and preamps and compressors are so great.

01:55:03.153 –> 01:55:06.093
Mason Stoops: And here’s all the reasons why it doesn’t matter.

01:55:06.093 –> 01:55:15.193
Mason Stoops: Which is to say, like, you know, like we made a record in our living room with my roommates, who are all touring musicians and we had a Fostex tape machine.

01:55:15.193 –> 01:55:21.433
Mason Stoops: We got off Craigslist and we did microphones basically right into the Fostex, which was like, this can’t be right.

01:55:21.433 –> 01:55:23.993
Mason Stoops: And Jesse was like, just, just try it.

01:55:23.993 –> 01:55:24.753
Mason Stoops: You know, you don’t know.

01:55:25.853 –> 01:55:28.393
Mason Stoops: And it turns out it sounds amazing and it was really cool.

01:55:28.393 –> 01:55:35.633
Mason Stoops: And then all these friends that we’ve played this record for, which hasn’t come out yet, but everyone wants to know what microphones did you use and what gear did you use?

01:55:35.633 –> 01:55:40.513
Mason Stoops: And I would have been one of those people too, because I think we’re so trained to, to investigate.

01:55:40.513 –> 01:55:44.353
Mason Stoops: And I love, I love gear, I think more than anybody.

01:55:44.353 –> 01:55:52.513
Mason Stoops: But what I love most about it is like putting it down and it’s like the best guitar is the one like Lizzy said earlier, that was the one that was closest by when she needed it.

01:55:53.273 –> 01:55:55.053
Mason Stoops: So she’s what you got.

01:55:55.053 –> 01:55:56.673
Mason Stoops: Yeah, use what you have.

01:55:56.673 –> 01:56:01.273
Mason Stoops: We look at McGee with his TASCAM, you know, he’s like taking over the world right now.

01:56:01.273 –> 01:56:04.593
Mason Stoops: And everyone wants a TASCAM Porta Studio now for that sound.

01:56:04.593 –> 01:56:08.273
Mason Stoops: But the only reason he used that was that’s what was nearby.

01:56:08.273 –> 01:56:19.873
Mason Stoops: So as much as we all want to get excited, and especially I want to get excited about vintage gear or rare gear or microphones or whatever, the coolest thing is going to be what’s nearby.

01:56:19.873 –> 01:56:26.773
Mason Stoops: And if that’s a TASCAM or if that’s your iPhone because you just wrote the song, like there’s magic there and you got to make room for it.

01:56:26.773 –> 01:56:27.293
Mason Stoops: You got to just-

01:56:27.293 –> 01:56:28.693
Lizzy McAlpine: Leave room for magic.

01:56:28.693 –> 01:56:30.293
Lizzy McAlpine: That’s Mason’s advice.

01:56:31.593 –> 01:56:33.013
Taylor Mackall: Taylor?

01:56:33.013 –> 01:56:33.533
Taylor Mackall: I don’t know.

01:56:33.533 –> 01:56:43.793
Taylor Mackall: I feel like we’ve all gotten here and found each other in this band from like following what we think is beautiful and listening to that.

01:56:43.813 –> 01:56:50.473
Taylor Mackall: And that’s how I met Mason was just like pursuing what I thought was beautiful for years and years and years.

01:56:50.473 –> 01:56:55.953
Taylor Mackall: And then I met Mason and then we started down this road together and we all found each other.

01:56:55.953 –> 01:56:57.573
Taylor Mackall: We found Lizzy and Lizzy found us.

01:56:57.573 –> 01:57:03.213
Taylor Mackall: So, yeah, if you’re not doing that, then you’re really not in service to your voice.

01:57:03.213 –> 01:57:07.833
Taylor Mackall: And you have to do that because that’ll help you find your people.

01:57:07.833 –> 01:57:10.133
Taylor Mackall: And then you can make more beautiful stuff together.

01:57:10.133 –> 01:57:12.193
Taylor Mackall: So, I’m grateful I’ve done that.

01:57:12.193 –> 01:57:22.093
Taylor Mackall: And I would encourage artists to do the same thing because you discover more kindred musical souls and more about yourself and that’s what’s up.

01:57:22.093 –> 01:57:25.053
Taylor Mackall: And that’s what we’re doing tomorrow on tour, you know?

01:57:25.053 –> 01:57:26.953
Taylor Mackall: So, keeps going.

01:57:26.953 –> 01:57:27.493
John Kennedy: Brilliant.

01:57:27.493 –> 01:57:29.913
John Kennedy: That’s sound advice as far as I’m concerned.

01:57:29.913 –> 01:57:31.113
John Kennedy: Thank you so much for your time.

01:57:31.113 –> 01:57:33.513
John Kennedy: Thanks for taking the time out from the tour to talk to us.

01:57:34.453 –> 01:57:35.753
Mason Stoops: You didn’t give us any advice.

01:57:38.013 –> 01:57:41.113
John Kennedy: Well, listen to all the Tape Notes episodes.

01:57:41.113 –> 01:57:41.433
Mason Stoops: Okay.

01:57:41.893 –> 01:57:45.033
John Kennedy: And you’ll get more advice than you’ll ever need.

01:57:45.033 –> 01:57:46.033
John Kennedy: Nice.

01:57:46.873 –> 01:57:48.573
John Kennedy: That’s my own message.

01:57:50.633 –> 01:57:51.473
Mason Stoops: That’s awesome.

01:57:51.473 –> 01:57:53.173
John Kennedy: We should play out with one more song from the album.

01:57:53.173 –> 01:57:57.373
John Kennedy: I’m thinking we need to hear a prime example of the Fun Machine.

01:57:57.373 –> 01:57:58.073
Lizzy McAlpine: Come Down Soon?

01:57:58.073 –> 01:57:59.753
Mason Stoops: Come Down Soon, yeah.

01:57:59.753 –> 01:58:00.173
John Kennedy: Okay.

01:58:00.173 –> 01:58:01.913
John Kennedy: So that’s the one we will play out with.

01:58:02.413 –> 01:58:03.433
John Kennedy: Thank you again.

01:58:03.433 –> 01:58:07.033
John Kennedy: And this is Come Down Soon, featuring the Fun Machine in full effect.

01:58:07.033 –> 01:58:08.393
John Kennedy: It’s Lizzy McAlpine.

01:58:22.013 –> 01:58:22.933
John Kennedy: Thank you for listening.

01:58:22.933 –> 01:58:27.313
John Kennedy: And in particular, thanks to all of you who have signed up to support us on Patreon.

01:58:27.313 –> 01:58:31.473
John Kennedy: I’m just one part of the team that brings you Tape Notes and it relies on your support.

01:58:31.913 –> 01:58:39.813
John Kennedy: Access to Patreon includes the full-length videos of new episodes where possible, ad-free episodes and detailed gear lists among many other things.

01:58:39.813 –> 01:58:43.593
John Kennedy: If you’d like to join, head to the link on our socials or website.

01:58:43.593 –> 01:58:48.753
John Kennedy: For pictures, highlight clips and behind-the-scenes content, head to our Instagram or YouTube channel.

01:58:48.753 –> 01:58:52.293
John Kennedy: And on Discord, you can join the growing Tape Notes community.

01:58:52.293 –> 01:58:53.833
John Kennedy: Once again, thank you for listening.

01:58:53.833 –> 01:58:55.173
John Kennedy: Until next time, goodbye.